missy

There are only a handful of comedians whose album releases qualify as cultural events, but Patton Oswalt is one of them. Tracks from his new CD, My Weakness is Strong are already being dissected by comedy enthusiasts in coffee shops around the country and picked apart on social networks like Twitter for the exquisite one-liners, the acutely-lobbed political grenades, and moments of inspired lunacy that compare to his memorable tangle with a screaming heckler on his last album, Werewolves and Lollipops. That CD, released during the death throes of the Bush administration, was widely hailed for its stance of supreme indignation and undercurrent of soul-weariness that mirrored the national mood at the time, and cemented Oswalts reputation as a comedian who loses no ground by going topical and getting angry.

Since that time, the 40 year-old and new father has continued to play to rabid fans at intimate clubs, tossing out brief, memorable bits such as one in which a Youtube user is re-imagined as an insatiable Roman emperor. An acting career that began with a run on King of Queens has also accelerated, with Oswalt winning critical kudos for his voice work in the 2007 animated adventure Ratatouille. This week also sees the release of Big Fan, a pitch black indie comedy that marks the directing debut of Robert Siegel, screenwriter of The Wrestler. Oswalt plays Paul Aufiero, a 35 year-old trapped in a state of permanent adolescence, living with his mother, and pouring his love and his energy into an obsession with the New York Giants a one-sided relationship if there ever was one. He loves his team, and he shows them he loves them through suffering, is how Oswalt summed it up to me when we met up last week at a Manhattan bar to talk about the film, as well as the state of comedy in 2009.


Patton Oswalt: Ive done a lot of interviews with you guys, with the late, great Dan Epstein.

Ryan Stewart: I know, I think Ive read them all. Great stuff.

PO: So, what the fuck happened? Did they ever know? No one has ever told me.

RS: I honestly dont know. I read that it was sudden and unexpected, but I dont have a connection there.

PO: But it was never explained. And I met him a couple of times and he always seemed so hale and hearty. I mean, what the fuck? That just sucks so fucking hard.

RS: I was sort of brought in during the wake of that whole thing. I would like to have gotten to know him, though.

PO: Oh, he was the best. I would get into fights with him. I would be like Why did you just ask me that? Thats stupid! And hed be like Oh, um, sorry I always just loved how we would go back and forth, it was so great.

RS: Could you back him down?

PO: No! He would totally defend it. He would hand it right back to me, and I loved it, it was great. I loved it!

RS: Someone just told me that the original title of Big Fan was Paul Aufiero, which kind of stopped me, cause thats a way, way better title. Theres just something about it. Agree?

PO: Are you kidding? I think its a fantastic title. I also thought Sydney was a way better title than Hard Eight. But there you go! [laughs]

RS: The only other obsessive sports movie that comes to my mind is the one where Jimmy Fallon is one of those guys, but hes also dating Drew Barrymore. Unrealistic!

PO: Yeah, but that character was a functioning guy. His fandom was the kind of fandom that enhances a life. Pauls is fandom in place of a life. But you know, in a weird way, theres also a love story in this movie. Its just that, as Robert put it, its an unrequited love. He loves his team. And hes going to show them he loves them through suffering. Its that classic case of Youll really start to love me when I dont leave you after Ive been abused. Its that kind of thing, that whole pathology.

RS: I know guys like Paul. Mid-thirties, no ambition. They seem to get along okay, for the most part.

PO: Go to some rep. theaters in L.A. on a weeknight, like I do all the time. Go to the New Beverly and youll see some people for whom movies have completely replaced their lives. Its no longer a supplement to their existence, it is their existence. Its very, very sad, those autograph hounds, those guys with the weird, tattered copies of the Leonard Maltin movie guide, checking off what theyve seen and havent seen thats really fucked up.

RS: Does Paul have an out? Does he have opportunity?

PO: I think he has nothing but opportunity, but theres really no ability on his part to pursue it. The opportunities are there and they will continue to be there, but hes actively waging a war against that door being opened. He does not want to change, at all, and it really activates him when someone comes along and tries to make him change. He really fights against that. Hes kind of a perfect combination of sad and noble.

RS: Was it easy to get into the headspace of a low-energy, low-ambition kind of guy?

PO: Well, as ambitious as I am with my comedy and as a writer, I do have that aspect in me where I just want to sit back and watch movies. And Ive also seen people like that in my life. In show business, you see a lot of delusional, damaged people. People whove rejected life. Theyve really, really rejected life. I see that in a lot of my friends and in me where we have one foot on the edge of having way too much passion for our own good, you know? You also see that in the biographies of some people like H.P. Lovecraft. Thats one that immediately comes to mind as a guy who was just, like, against life.

RS: The obsession is ultimately a symptom of what? Boredom or depression?

PO: Thats a good question. Which came first? Would this person have filled his life with something else if the object of his fan desire wasnt there? Or would he just be this weird kind of empty shell? I cant say! [laughs]

RS: What I loved most about the movie was that sudden ramp-up in the beginning of the third act. Were suddenly made aware that we havent been privy to al of his thoughts. Did you like that?

PO: Yes! Thats what I really loved. This is one of those rare movies where it goes into the third act and youre suddenly like I have no fucking idea whats going to happen now but it seems to be going someplace really bad. Things start to get really, really bad. Yeah, thats also what I dug about it. The fact that you asked that question is, I think, what makes it such a good movie. Its that you just do not know, and the movie is not going to go, okay, lets hold up here and let me answer some of your questions. It just doesnt do that. Instead, it opens this tiny window. Its like those great movies of the early 70s, like McCabe & Mrs. Miller or Night Moves, where its like Hmm..thats all Im gonna see, now Ive got to put the rest together myself. People used to get excited by that. They were like, okay, now Im engaged lets figure this movie out.

RS: Now, not so much!

PO: Ehhhhhh, not so much! Didnt Readers Digest just file for bankruptcy? A magazine that boils books and magazines down to shorter versions? People didnt have the attention span to read that!

RS: Going back to the movie nerd parallel, I also saw a specific comparison to the way that todays seasoned movie nerd is expected to have a finely-honed opinion about each studio, like its a team.

PO: Good lord, yes! I never thought of it that way. Or even a production company, like, saying Oh, they always put out this or that. I mean, just look at the Weinstein Co., with that New York Times Profile on Sunday. Theyre being treated just like a sports franchise thats gone into some weird twilight phase. Its all like, what happened to their glory years? The company becomes a bigger personality than the people involved.

RS: Why cant people just consume their entertainment without getting under the hood and getting a closer look at their icons?

PO: Im going to argue that there is something inside of us that seeks out things to worship and elevate, if only to give us something to aim at in ourselves. The only way we survived as a species was that we evolved. The main thing about evolution is improvement and refinement, and it certainly helps that process if you have a target or a symbol that you can focus on for your improvement. Oddly enough, the fact that we have religion is proof that evolution is real. Its further proof, to me, anyway. We seek a godhead or a demigod or some other elevated figure that we can evolve toward. We invented that and we focus on it, in order to give us something to aim towards, just subconsciously. So, the fact that we invented religion and the fact that we created God proves that evolution is real.

RS: I think you might have blown my mind.

PO: Youre welcome.

RS: I thought you were going in a simpler direction, of just saying that we want to best our own Philly Phil [Pauls rival, who he spars with throughout the movie on a radio call-in show] across the street. We have to top our rival.

PO: Thats just a tinier version, though. Thats just a cul de sac of evolution. That might be the definition of a failure a guy who picks a really lame target to defeat, and then once hes defeated them, thats it; thats all hes gonna get. Hes never gonna do anything amazing, because he picked a shitty target to focus on. Pick a better target! Get a bigger weapon, as Boots Riley of The Coup would say.

RS: I dont think Michael Rapaport would mind me saying that hes a spectacular douchebag.

PO: He was amazing. In scene after scene, this guy was completely tireless. He would just do take after take. And what was really weird was that, in talking to him in real life, hes just this sweet, kind of goofy guy. He was like Hey everyone, how ya doin? and always talking with people, but then in the scene and it wasnt like he did some crazy thing where he was like Oh, now Ive got to put my actor face on. He would just slowly crank it up. He was so fucking annoying! But you know, most actors dont want to play that kind of abrasive, repulsive guy any more, and this guy, he just loves playing characters.

RS: I think Paul resents that Philly Phil doesnt give a shit, he just spews forth whatever is at the top of his mind. Meanwhile, Paul is going as far as to craft his bon mots in a notebook ahead of time.

PO: Right, hes just spewing forth the easiest things that everyone else says. Although, even through struggling in his notebook to write that stuff down, Pauls still struggling for his art. I showed my team my love through my industry and my labor. Its basically like Salieri pledging to Jesus, you know? I think in his mind, this is all a performance. This is my art and I prepare, the same way that a musician tunes up or an athlete warms up, basically. That day job I have? Thats just to pay for my art."
RS: Do comedians tend to pocket some good comeback lines, in case they need them to slap down a heckler or fight with Carlos Mencia?

PO: I certainly dont. I think it becomes so clear, if youre up on stage, that you had a line ready. I prefer to talk to them and let them hang themselves. I never have something where its like Just wait, Im gonna wham him with this line. Instead, I amplify whatever it is that theyre doing until they pop. I can handle hecklers pretty well, and its not because Im so amazing. Its because Ive been defeated by hecklers many times and the world didnt end the next day. Thats why Im without fear now. Ive seen it crash and burn so many times that it doesnt matter to me, either way. Its not going to change a thing about tomorrow. I think a lot of hecklers are like Boy, hes gonna remember me, but I just tune that out and then I take care of them and then I reactivate what Im doing. I go back to doing the material that I like. Hecklers really have no impact on me, you know? On my second album, I deal with a heckler on one of the tracks and when the producer of the album played me the thing to say, you know, you should leave this in here, I had totally forgotten that it happened. It just meant nothing to me. I find it so boring.

RS: Was that the guy who gave a kind of Lynyrd Skynyrd yell?

PO: It was a guy who makes some weird noise during a bit where Im building up to something, and theres some silence on there, and then he starts yelling. I can barely even remember what I said to him, because it didnt mean anything. I had totally checked out during that, and I didnt want to include that on the track, because if you actually listen to what Im saying you can tell that theres no passion in what Im saying. Im more like, Ugh, I gotta deal with this guy, and then I go right back to what I was doing.

RS: I think that was also the album where you commented on the state of comedy at the time, and you said it was a golden age because comedy fans were having to seek out the comedians.

PO: Its gotten ten times better. Those audiences have stuck around and the comedians who are flourishing now are so fucking good.

RS: Like who?

PO: Well, where do you live? Theyre out there. Anthony Jeselnik. Natasha Leggero. James Adomian. Kyle Kinane. There are so many that are coming up right now that are just fucking amazing. Not just good. Im talking about holy-shit-theyve-found-their-voice-way-early. Theyre just gonna run with it, theyre amazing. And these young comedians are starting to get looked at for TV, and the fact that Conan OBrien is in L.A. now and is very interested in showcasing young comedians, and the fact that Jimmy Fallon is very much looking for young comedians in New York, both of those scenes are just so fucking fantastic right now. It ended up getting way better than I described it back then. I thought that it was happening in waves, and maybe it is, maybe this will end up being a wave, but if it is its gonna be a fucking huge one, with all of these people coming up. Its just ridiculous right now.

RS: But I want open-mic wingnuts, too! I want Dr. Pepper.

PO: Hey, I hope those guys come back too theyre fun! Nothing wrong with that, but for the most part the shows themselves are not being put on by the clubs, theyre being put on by other comedians. The ones putting them on are lovers of comedy. And every night, theres some great shit going on. Its fantastic.

RS: Do you expect your comedy to become less political going forward, now that weve sort of said goodbye to all that?

PO: No. Theres plenty of political stuff on my new album. I think, if anything, politics is always affecting the world in one way or the other. Whats great about Obama is just watching to see how certain people react to him. I mean, that is fascinating. Its just as crazed and insane as how I felt about Bush, you know? Whats really great about it is that I can look at a lot of the ways people are dealing with Obama not just comedians, I mean the public and I see a lot of what I did wrong during the Bush years, a lot of the easy stuff like the Hitler comparisons.

RS: The stuff about Bush causing the biblical apocalypse, and that stuff?

PO: Well, actually, the apocalypse one was one where I felt like I went for something a little better. But I do look at what theyre doing with Obama and I know that I was just as guilty of that. I fucked that up. Its good to see it from the other side and be able to go Oh, so thats where I was wrong.

RS: So, how does a comedian approach Obama?

PO: Well, Ive never found more ways to say Theres a black guy in the White House without actually saying Theres a black guy in the White House. [redneck voice] I want my country back! We are on the verge of fascism! Its so great, its fascinating! There is nothing more fun for a comedian than watching a country lose its shit.

Big Fan opens in select cities this Friday. My Weakness is Strong, Patton Oswalts new comedy album, is in stores this week.