Al Jourgensen has just released the last chapter in the annals of his nearly three decade-long career as the self-professed maniac behind industrial godfathers Ministry. Its appropriately titled "The Last Sucker" and also serves as the final piece in Ministrys trilogy of albums attacking the Bush Administration and the United States current political system. Al is also throwing one last party, in the shape of a World Tour and a party album of covers, before he splits to allow fans a chance to say goodbye and dance with him on Ministrys grave. Jourgensen chatted with Aaron Detroit about his plans post-Ministry, the 2008 Presidential elections, and why hes looking forward to being the mysterious producer guy that wears a cloak around town.
Aaron Detroit: Hey Al, hows it going? What are you up to?
Al Jourgensen: Good. Im in Hell Paso, Texas at the studio. Right now, were finishing up the last two days on the Ministry covers album.
AD: Thats the Ministry and Co-Conspirators album?
AJ: Thats right, Ministry and Co-Conspirators. Its called Cover Up.
AD: What covers have you been working on?
AJ: [Laughs] Its gonna be good! Lets see, The exact running order is Black Betty (originally) by Ram Jam, Space Truckin by Deep Purple, Mississippi Queen by Mountain, Just Got Paid by ZZ Top, and then some of the other ones weve released before: Roadhouse Blues and Supernaut. Robin Zander from Cheap Trick is singing on Radar Love and Foghats Slow Ride. [Fear Factorys] Burton Bell sings on the Stones Under My Thumb," and Wayne from Static X sings on Shes So Heavy by The Beatles. Then theres Van Morrisons Baby Blue and my favorite, What a Wonderful World by Louis Armstrong. Theyre all Ministry-sized.
AD: How did you come to the decision to do these particular covers?
AJ: Well part of them were from a contest we held on the website with the Piss Army [Ministrys Fan Club]. Some of them were from that, and some of them came from knuckleheads like [Prongs] Tommy Victor going Thats my favorite fucking song! [laughs]. So theres no real rhyme or reason to it, its just a big party album. No politics! All party!
AD: Did you burn yourself out a bit with the last three Ministry records having been so focused on politics?
AJ: No, Im not burnt at all. Im not burnt as a concerned citizen, a person just doesnt live by bread alone. You can protest all day, but you gotta go drinking at night.
AD: Exactly!
AJ: [Laughs]
AD: So is this really the last thing youre doing as Ministry?
AJ: Done! Done! Next!
AD: So no big Ministry Reunion tour in 15 years?
AJ: I dont think so, my friend. First of all, who am I gonna get to reunion-ize with? Im the fucking band. So unless I make a reunion with myself whatever, no. Ive got a lot of other stuff going on. Literally, Im booked solid for the next 15 months. I know exactly what Im doing for the next 15 months, plus Ive got a record label [Thirteenth Planet Records], Ive got a lot of other bands I need to baby-sit for. There would be no time, need, or inclination to every get some kind of redundancy going on.
AD: Youve mentioned in the past that you never really liked being a front person as you were in Ministry, So is this the end of Al - front and center, as well?
AJ: Yeah, now Im the Jimmy Page instead of the Robert Plant. Now I live in a weird castle, I read Crowley, I twiddle knobs, and get to be the mysterious producer guy that wears a cloak around town! [Laughs] Right?! Well, something like that.
AD: [Laughs] With Thirteenth Planet Records, are there any bands you have signed that are picking up Ministrys torch in regards to making political protest music?
AJ: Not so far on this label. There is a general malaise and discontent amongst the populous, whether its related to politics or not. I mean, these are very confusing times, but this is not a war protest, Cindy Sheehan record label. I sign good artists that have good shit to say and it doesnt have to be about Bush. Everyone has this idea that Im completely obsessed with this guy. You know what? Hes an Idiot and thats granted, but Im not obsessed. Im just pissed off at whats going on and as are a lot of other people. But other people might feel more comfortable singing about other stuff and thats great, thats what its supposed to be about. This just so happens to be what Im comfortable singing about. And I say singing in a loose way, so lets not get carried away!
AD: [Laughs] Do you think, regarding the war and the current state of world affairs, there is a change coming? I mean, do you have any faith in people to make the sacrifices and changes necessary? Or do you think were going to wade further out into the cesspool?
AJ: I really dont see a lot of fundamental change coming up after a Democrat gets in office, because to me thats pretty obvious thats whats going to happen. The problem is that the system is broken. All the candidates from either party are owned by the same people. So well see some cosmetic changes, like I keep saying, well probably see some cheaper iPhones.
AD: [Laughs]
AJ: Well probably see a couple attempts at alternative fuel, and I say attempts mind you. Thatll keep people pacified, so theyre not rioting in the streets and screaming, The worlds falling apart! You guys suck!
AD: What do you think will be the American publics breaking point? What is the turning point? Would it be The Draft? What is it actually going to make people stand up and say, Im mad as hell and Im not going to take it anymore?
AJ: I think were at the breaking point now. Its really great in the short term to get governed by fear, which is whats happening now. I pretty much put that out there in that Eisenhower speech from 59 on this new record.
AD: Thats on the last track of the album, The End of Days?
AJ: Yeah. So weve come a really long way, yeah? [Laughs] You Know? Its the same shit. In a short term solution to ascend and hold on to power, fear is a great motivator, just ask Joseph Goebbels from the Nazi party. It works great in the short term. But not if youre talking about a ten thousand year Reich, which is what Karl Rove thought. It only works in the short term because people reach the fulcrum or the tipping point and say, Fuck this! Im tired of looking for terrorists under my couch, bed and pillows and everywhere I go. Im not going to live like that. Fear is a motivator for only a short period of time and I think people are fed up with it.
AD: In what shape or form is the change going to come in? Elections?
AJ: Well, like I said, I think the election will get us cosmetic changes. Everyone asks me, Are you gonna vote for Hillary? Well, no.
AD: Well, she calls Rupert Murdoch one of her constituents!
AJ: Exactly! Why should I (vote for her)!? Its the same fucking zebul. Not even if its Clinton, even if its Barrack Obama. I dont wanna hear about how hes the new face of politics, give me a fucking break. Theyve all been bought and sold by special interest. Until we change the system, nothing is going to happen. When people ask me who Im going to vote for, Ill tell you what, Im going to vote for any other party except the two names that we have, Democrat or Republican. If enough peoplewell, everyone says thats a wasted vote, everyone got all mad at Nader, Oh, he ruined the election, all that shit.
AD: Thats just not an understanding of the Electoral College.
AJ: Yeah, exactly. But what Im trying to say is, if more people voted independently and voted their conscience, voted with their brains instead of voting for the lesser of two evils, we might actually have a third party or a fourth or a fifth or a sixth. It is not a wasted vote. Stay informed, stay active because it affects your future, but just dont vote for the lesser of two evils, vote for what you believe.
AD: We definitely need to get the Republicans out of office though.
AJ: Cosmetic change, sure. I think that is where the country is going and everyone will feel all warm and fuzzy for six or seven years. Oh yay! But its been the same old bullshit since the mid-1800s. The assassination of Lincoln, that started it all. Cosmetic changes are great, but I dont see a fundamental change. We have to look within ourselves. Its not just fixing the political system by taking the special interest out of democracy. Because the money is already spent, the people are all ready bought, the candidates are already sold. Theres nothing you can really do unless we get rid of this actual system. The system has to be changed so money is not the only factor. So that its ideas not money that gets somebody elected to govern for the people, not against the people. But its also a fundamental change from within. Do we really need all this shit that advertisers just shove down our throats? Like the only way that youre a cool person is if you have flat abs and own a BMW? Its this kind of consumerism thats consumed us.
AD: I live in Los Angeles, you dont have to tell me! [Laughs]
AJ: [Laughs] There you go. Its the same thing that happened in Rome. Were at that stage.
AD: With you being so vocal politically, against the administration and the war, have you experienced any repercussions from Uncle Sam? Susan Sarandon, who is for sure a dissenting voice, recently told Jon Stewart on "The Daily Show" that both her and her fellow celebrity activist, Sean Penns phones are tapped.
AJ: Of course. I wouldnt be doing the right thing if that didnt happen.
AD: So youre on all the right lists? [Laughs]
AJ: Of course. These days thats the feather in your cap. Old Uncle Georgie sicked the IRS on me a couple years ago and tried to make it as painful as possible. They figured me being named Al and from Chicago that theyd take the tax route to get me in jail, but that didnt work because all my taxes were in order. As far as my phones being tapped, I cant think for one possible second that theyre not. Whatever, Ive got nothing to hide. I dont do drugs, I dont drive drunk, I dont rob banks, I dont have extramarital affairs, I dont have any kind of scandal sheet on me. My life before five years ago is pretty much an open book. I was pretty much an open book maniac, but those days are over. So they can do whatever they want.
AD: Is being sober what made you so prolific in the last few years?
AJ: Well yeah, Im no longer working on Dealer Standard Time [laughs].
AD: [Laughs]
AJ: Well, you know, the fuckers take forever. I could never get any work done. [Laughs]
AD: [Laughs] Ministry is about to embark on its last tour ever. How are you balancing older material with the new album?
AJ: Well weve got lots of dancing girls, lots of dancing girls! [Laughs] Its pretty much a fucking jukebox hootenanny. Since its the last one, all the knuckleheads are gonna wanna here all the old stuff, some kids will wanna hear the new stuff, its basically put a quarter in my mouth, turn my ear, and I spit out the hits, right? But no, its gonna be fun. Were going to be playing for a long time, its about two and a half hours of material. Its gonna be like the Grateful Dead of Industrial or something [laughs].
AD: And whats on your plate post-Ministry?
AJ: Well lets see, Ive got so much going on its crazy. The covers album is coming out, which is kick ass. Its a total party on wheels. Were half way through the last Revolting cocks record. Were being prolific little boys here. Were like Jack at the fucking Overlook Hotel, All Work, No Play, Right? The Cocks record is very cockish and its the last one, Im putting it to bed as well. Its called Got Cock? Im having a lot of fun with it. Were doing a Cocks covers record right after that, bowing out in the same way as Ministry. Do a regular album then do whatever covers you want to do with a bunch of friends that happen to be hanging around at the time. Then well take it from there. Theres some really great stuff coming out on the label. The new Prong record, Power of the Damager, is coming out. Its just fucking amazing. I think its Tommys best ever, at least since his first two.
AD: Well, thanks Al, this has been great, any parting words?
AJ: Buy our T-Shirts! Buy our swag! [Laughs] Make us Republicans! Make us rich! [Laughs]
AD: Ill gladly put money in your pocket any day, Al.
AJ: [Laughs] Alright! Thanks, man!
Ministry begins its final world tour March 25th in Vancouver, B.C. Photographs by Steffan Chirazi
Aaron Detroit: Hey Al, hows it going? What are you up to?
Al Jourgensen: Good. Im in Hell Paso, Texas at the studio. Right now, were finishing up the last two days on the Ministry covers album.
AD: Thats the Ministry and Co-Conspirators album?
AJ: Thats right, Ministry and Co-Conspirators. Its called Cover Up.
AD: What covers have you been working on?
AJ: [Laughs] Its gonna be good! Lets see, The exact running order is Black Betty (originally) by Ram Jam, Space Truckin by Deep Purple, Mississippi Queen by Mountain, Just Got Paid by ZZ Top, and then some of the other ones weve released before: Roadhouse Blues and Supernaut. Robin Zander from Cheap Trick is singing on Radar Love and Foghats Slow Ride. [Fear Factorys] Burton Bell sings on the Stones Under My Thumb," and Wayne from Static X sings on Shes So Heavy by The Beatles. Then theres Van Morrisons Baby Blue and my favorite, What a Wonderful World by Louis Armstrong. Theyre all Ministry-sized.
AD: How did you come to the decision to do these particular covers?
AJ: Well part of them were from a contest we held on the website with the Piss Army [Ministrys Fan Club]. Some of them were from that, and some of them came from knuckleheads like [Prongs] Tommy Victor going Thats my favorite fucking song! [laughs]. So theres no real rhyme or reason to it, its just a big party album. No politics! All party!
AD: Did you burn yourself out a bit with the last three Ministry records having been so focused on politics?
AJ: No, Im not burnt at all. Im not burnt as a concerned citizen, a person just doesnt live by bread alone. You can protest all day, but you gotta go drinking at night.
AD: Exactly!
AJ: [Laughs]
AD: So is this really the last thing youre doing as Ministry?
AJ: Done! Done! Next!
AD: So no big Ministry Reunion tour in 15 years?
AJ: I dont think so, my friend. First of all, who am I gonna get to reunion-ize with? Im the fucking band. So unless I make a reunion with myself whatever, no. Ive got a lot of other stuff going on. Literally, Im booked solid for the next 15 months. I know exactly what Im doing for the next 15 months, plus Ive got a record label [Thirteenth Planet Records], Ive got a lot of other bands I need to baby-sit for. There would be no time, need, or inclination to every get some kind of redundancy going on.
AD: Youve mentioned in the past that you never really liked being a front person as you were in Ministry, So is this the end of Al - front and center, as well?
AJ: Yeah, now Im the Jimmy Page instead of the Robert Plant. Now I live in a weird castle, I read Crowley, I twiddle knobs, and get to be the mysterious producer guy that wears a cloak around town! [Laughs] Right?! Well, something like that.
AD: [Laughs] With Thirteenth Planet Records, are there any bands you have signed that are picking up Ministrys torch in regards to making political protest music?
AJ: Not so far on this label. There is a general malaise and discontent amongst the populous, whether its related to politics or not. I mean, these are very confusing times, but this is not a war protest, Cindy Sheehan record label. I sign good artists that have good shit to say and it doesnt have to be about Bush. Everyone has this idea that Im completely obsessed with this guy. You know what? Hes an Idiot and thats granted, but Im not obsessed. Im just pissed off at whats going on and as are a lot of other people. But other people might feel more comfortable singing about other stuff and thats great, thats what its supposed to be about. This just so happens to be what Im comfortable singing about. And I say singing in a loose way, so lets not get carried away!
AD: [Laughs] Do you think, regarding the war and the current state of world affairs, there is a change coming? I mean, do you have any faith in people to make the sacrifices and changes necessary? Or do you think were going to wade further out into the cesspool?
AJ: I really dont see a lot of fundamental change coming up after a Democrat gets in office, because to me thats pretty obvious thats whats going to happen. The problem is that the system is broken. All the candidates from either party are owned by the same people. So well see some cosmetic changes, like I keep saying, well probably see some cheaper iPhones.
AD: [Laughs]
AJ: Well probably see a couple attempts at alternative fuel, and I say attempts mind you. Thatll keep people pacified, so theyre not rioting in the streets and screaming, The worlds falling apart! You guys suck!
AD: What do you think will be the American publics breaking point? What is the turning point? Would it be The Draft? What is it actually going to make people stand up and say, Im mad as hell and Im not going to take it anymore?
AJ: I think were at the breaking point now. Its really great in the short term to get governed by fear, which is whats happening now. I pretty much put that out there in that Eisenhower speech from 59 on this new record.
AD: Thats on the last track of the album, The End of Days?
AJ: Yeah. So weve come a really long way, yeah? [Laughs] You Know? Its the same shit. In a short term solution to ascend and hold on to power, fear is a great motivator, just ask Joseph Goebbels from the Nazi party. It works great in the short term. But not if youre talking about a ten thousand year Reich, which is what Karl Rove thought. It only works in the short term because people reach the fulcrum or the tipping point and say, Fuck this! Im tired of looking for terrorists under my couch, bed and pillows and everywhere I go. Im not going to live like that. Fear is a motivator for only a short period of time and I think people are fed up with it.
AD: In what shape or form is the change going to come in? Elections?
AJ: Well, like I said, I think the election will get us cosmetic changes. Everyone asks me, Are you gonna vote for Hillary? Well, no.
AD: Well, she calls Rupert Murdoch one of her constituents!
AJ: Exactly! Why should I (vote for her)!? Its the same fucking zebul. Not even if its Clinton, even if its Barrack Obama. I dont wanna hear about how hes the new face of politics, give me a fucking break. Theyve all been bought and sold by special interest. Until we change the system, nothing is going to happen. When people ask me who Im going to vote for, Ill tell you what, Im going to vote for any other party except the two names that we have, Democrat or Republican. If enough peoplewell, everyone says thats a wasted vote, everyone got all mad at Nader, Oh, he ruined the election, all that shit.
AD: Thats just not an understanding of the Electoral College.
AJ: Yeah, exactly. But what Im trying to say is, if more people voted independently and voted their conscience, voted with their brains instead of voting for the lesser of two evils, we might actually have a third party or a fourth or a fifth or a sixth. It is not a wasted vote. Stay informed, stay active because it affects your future, but just dont vote for the lesser of two evils, vote for what you believe.
AD: We definitely need to get the Republicans out of office though.
AJ: Cosmetic change, sure. I think that is where the country is going and everyone will feel all warm and fuzzy for six or seven years. Oh yay! But its been the same old bullshit since the mid-1800s. The assassination of Lincoln, that started it all. Cosmetic changes are great, but I dont see a fundamental change. We have to look within ourselves. Its not just fixing the political system by taking the special interest out of democracy. Because the money is already spent, the people are all ready bought, the candidates are already sold. Theres nothing you can really do unless we get rid of this actual system. The system has to be changed so money is not the only factor. So that its ideas not money that gets somebody elected to govern for the people, not against the people. But its also a fundamental change from within. Do we really need all this shit that advertisers just shove down our throats? Like the only way that youre a cool person is if you have flat abs and own a BMW? Its this kind of consumerism thats consumed us.
AD: I live in Los Angeles, you dont have to tell me! [Laughs]
AJ: [Laughs] There you go. Its the same thing that happened in Rome. Were at that stage.
AD: With you being so vocal politically, against the administration and the war, have you experienced any repercussions from Uncle Sam? Susan Sarandon, who is for sure a dissenting voice, recently told Jon Stewart on "The Daily Show" that both her and her fellow celebrity activist, Sean Penns phones are tapped.
AJ: Of course. I wouldnt be doing the right thing if that didnt happen.
AD: So youre on all the right lists? [Laughs]
AJ: Of course. These days thats the feather in your cap. Old Uncle Georgie sicked the IRS on me a couple years ago and tried to make it as painful as possible. They figured me being named Al and from Chicago that theyd take the tax route to get me in jail, but that didnt work because all my taxes were in order. As far as my phones being tapped, I cant think for one possible second that theyre not. Whatever, Ive got nothing to hide. I dont do drugs, I dont drive drunk, I dont rob banks, I dont have extramarital affairs, I dont have any kind of scandal sheet on me. My life before five years ago is pretty much an open book. I was pretty much an open book maniac, but those days are over. So they can do whatever they want.
AD: Is being sober what made you so prolific in the last few years?
AJ: Well yeah, Im no longer working on Dealer Standard Time [laughs].
AD: [Laughs]
AJ: Well, you know, the fuckers take forever. I could never get any work done. [Laughs]
AD: [Laughs] Ministry is about to embark on its last tour ever. How are you balancing older material with the new album?
AJ: Well weve got lots of dancing girls, lots of dancing girls! [Laughs] Its pretty much a fucking jukebox hootenanny. Since its the last one, all the knuckleheads are gonna wanna here all the old stuff, some kids will wanna hear the new stuff, its basically put a quarter in my mouth, turn my ear, and I spit out the hits, right? But no, its gonna be fun. Were going to be playing for a long time, its about two and a half hours of material. Its gonna be like the Grateful Dead of Industrial or something [laughs].
AD: And whats on your plate post-Ministry?
AJ: Well lets see, Ive got so much going on its crazy. The covers album is coming out, which is kick ass. Its a total party on wheels. Were half way through the last Revolting cocks record. Were being prolific little boys here. Were like Jack at the fucking Overlook Hotel, All Work, No Play, Right? The Cocks record is very cockish and its the last one, Im putting it to bed as well. Its called Got Cock? Im having a lot of fun with it. Were doing a Cocks covers record right after that, bowing out in the same way as Ministry. Do a regular album then do whatever covers you want to do with a bunch of friends that happen to be hanging around at the time. Then well take it from there. Theres some really great stuff coming out on the label. The new Prong record, Power of the Damager, is coming out. Its just fucking amazing. I think its Tommys best ever, at least since his first two.
AD: Well, thanks Al, this has been great, any parting words?
AJ: Buy our T-Shirts! Buy our swag! [Laughs] Make us Republicans! Make us rich! [Laughs]
AD: Ill gladly put money in your pocket any day, Al.
AJ: [Laughs] Alright! Thanks, man!
Ministry begins its final world tour March 25th in Vancouver, B.C. Photographs by Steffan Chirazi
VIEW 16 of 16 COMMENTS
dufsmash13:
saw em last week and got an Uncle Al for President bumper sticker. they kicked ass. 
mrrhinos:
I've seen Ministry live twice and i've got a ticket for their show in Glasgow at the end of May 