Eric Schaeffer
by Fred Topel for SuicideGirls (http://suicidegirls.com/)

Eric Schaeffer has a history with SuicideGirls. We interviewed him for his book, I Can’t Believe I’m Still Single, in 2007 and then featured him as a “sexpert” for a few weeks on the radio show. The author, TV producer, actor and filmmaker just released a new movie, After Fall, Winter so we got to reconnect.

Winter is the second in Schaeffer’s anticipated quartet, where every 15 years he will tell another story in Michael (Schaeffer)’s life. In Winter, Michael moves to France where he meets Sophie (Lizzie Brochere), who he doesn’t know is a professional dominatrix. Their manipulative relationship shifts as Michael explores masochism separately from Sophie.

A lot has happened for Schaeffer in the last five years. His dating blog tied to the release of his book became scandalous as women publicly challenged his posts. He’s also produced two more TV series and has another on the way. I’m sorry this interview becomes two guys complaining about dating. We felt each other’s pain, but came to a happy, hopeful place.

In fact, just before my phone call with Schaeffer, he’d reconnected with Betsy Fine, a girl he loved in 7th grade. She found him on Facebook and it turns out she’s a life coach, he’s researching a new show, Eric Schaeffer: Life Coach, so he spoke to her for research. She told him everything he imagines is true. So after Winter, there’s hope for Spring connections.

SG: Are the Suicide Girls your type of girl?

ES: Oh, completely. Yeah, completely. I don’t have any tattoos or piercings, except of course my left ear piercing from before anyone was born that I let close up 25 years ago. But they’re totally my style of girl.

SG: Your movie pointed out to me Americans don’t say hello first, do they?

ES: They may or they may not. L.A. actually is more than New York I’ve noticed a cordial place. Like when you’re in the supermarket, I find that people there will tend to look at you in the eye and say, “Hello” and “Goodbye” and more engage you in a little chat, more than in New York. But no, it seems to be a culture where what’s interesting is that it’s not considered rude here not to say hello and goodbye. It’s not that you’re being rude if you get in a cab and say “45th and 3rd” without saying, “Hello sir, how are you? 45th and 3rd.” It’s not that you’re being rude, it’s just our custom. So it’s interesting I think in France they consider it rude. My theory for the big misunderstanding of why everyone thinks the French people are assholes and why they all think Americans are rude. It’s simply just a cultural difference. We go in there and we start talking. They crinkle their face and look at us like they’re rude. We look at them and go, “What the fuck is their problem? I’m just asking for bread.” And everyone thinks the other one’s an asshole.

SG: There’s an American philosophy that you have to have an excuse to talk to someone, more than just saying hello. But the point of any conversation should be “Hello, I want to talk to you.”

ES: It’s funny, I’ll never forget. About 15-20 years ago I heard Dr. Ruth on the radio and she was saying, she confirmed my theory. She said, “The best way for a boy to meet a girl is just say, ‘Hi, my name is so and so. How are you?’” I’ve always thought that I’m this man on earth and you’re this girl on earth. Why is it not okay for me to just go in a nice pleasant cordial way, “Hi, you seem interesting. My name’s Eric, what’s yours?” It was so stupid but you’re allowed to do that. Then the person can go, “Fuck off” or turn on their iPod again. So you’re totally right. That’s the simplest and most appropriate way to engage someone in conversation.

SG: Most people appreciate it and want to converse. The ones who turn you down rudely are indicating they’re not someone we want to talk to anyway.

ES: Yeah, right, it’s a good barometer either way.

SG: Do you worry that casting yourself in a romance with a beautiful French woman could be seen as autobiographical, for better or worse, or even be seen as self-indulgent?

ES: No, that ship sailed a long time ago. I just find it comical for two reasons. One, every man that’s ever written a screenplay about he and a woman has envisioned that woman being beautiful. So I didn’t make up the idea of writing movies where I play the protagonist and my love interest is a beautiful women. Most writers don’t play themselves so they don’t get attacked for being “self-indulgent” or making movies so they can have pretty girls on the screen with them. Or, if they’re really beautiful guys, not just average looking guys like me, then they get away with it two. Two, that is always a comical accusation if it’s levied towards me because it presupposes that I in my regular life don’t date beautiful women. As if I’d have to go through the tremendous effort and war that it is to make an independent film and risk 100s of 1000s of my own dollars and other people’s hard earned money simply so that I could somehow act across from a pretty girl for two and a half weeks. So no, the answer is I don’t worry about that. If it makes sense for the story that the girl be easy on the eyes then that’s who I cast.

SG: How about as far as their conversations and the dialogue. Is it autobiographical?

ES: Oh yeah, 90% of what I write is stuff that’s either come out of my mouth with a woman that I’m courting or involved with and she to me, or that I would imagine saying. Good and bad. So in the movie when she emasculates me in the way that she knows will crush me in that sexual discussion scene…

SG: The blow job talk?

ES: Exactly, she would blow me if I was 10 lbs. thinner. That was said to me by a woman once. So it cuts both ways. I’m completely willing to put in dialogue that I think is charming and I’m also willing to put in dialogue where characters that I play get hurt by mean spirited barbs from other characters.

SG: The funny thing about that is I wish I had your body. I watch what I eat and work out a lot but I can’t even get within 10 lbs. of my goal weight.

ES: Neither can I. I will say that being in France somehow makes you thin. I don't know how that’s even possible but it does because I’m doing the exact same thing to the T, eating the same thing and working out the same in New York as I did in Paris and I put on 10 lbs. instantly when I got back. I’m having an extremely hard time taking it off.

SG: Did you explore the dominatrix world as research for this film, or just on your own?

ES: I definitely dabbled in BDSM in my personal life, probably for the last 10 years. Again, nothing close to a lifestyle and I don’t fetisihize anything. It’s all in the realm of some sort of midlevel exploration that I think a lot of people do. Once again, I’m just somebody who is public about it. So I had dabbled in it a little bit over the years and always thought it would be a very interesting subject matter for a film because there are very few films that have BDSM in a plot that are not over the top, comical or pornographic, to say that that’s a storyline and a theme that doesn’t have a lot of intellectual complex realistic human elements to the story. So I thought it would be interesting to have a film that has psychologically more than even physically the dynamics of a BDSM relationship.

SG: I know it’s a common fetish. I just don’t get it. I don’t feel a need to pay a woman to be mean to me. I think I already get that for free.

ES: [Laughs] Yeah, one of my classic lines to some of the pro doms I’ve seen in my life, invariably after whatever scene is played out that you discussed in advance of whatever kind of role play or scene you’re going to do in that hour, inevitably there’s a human and non role playing just normal side that comes out after it’s over. There’s just some chatting and you usually like each other and you’ve just shared this very intimate experience. Once in a while I’ve had a woman, a pro dom, in that time of being “normal” say something mean to me. Like if I maybe ask her out and she says, “Oh no, I don't think that would work out.” And I say, “Listen, don’t be mean. I mean, I want you to be mean to me but don’t be mean to me.” You know what I mean? It’s like good pain if you’ve ever played sports. There’s good pain and bad pain, or like when you’re getting a massage. That’s the bad pain. The good pain is if I tell you to twist my arm, then that’s good pain. But if I ask you out and you say, “No, I would never go out with someone like you,” That’s the bad pain. At that point just

lie. Lie and say you have a boyfriend.

SG: Is the aggressive sex scene in the doorway part of the dominatrix theme?

ES: I wanted to have that sort of rough sex scene in the movie for a couple reasons. One to show that in his personal life he was actually capable, if not primarily dominant. In his professional dominatrix world that he was a submissive, but that in his personal sexual life he was more classically dominant like most men are. So it was important for me for his character and their relationship for him to be dominant in that way.

SG: But you do go down on her which is something you don’t see in Hollywood sex scenes.

ES: Except, actually funny, in The American, he actually goes down on a hooker, which talk about what you don’t do on top of what you don’t do. It’s actually a very sexy scene but you’re right. It is very rare but you’re right, that could be seen in certain circles as somehow emasculating.

SG: Oh, I didn’t mean that going down on someone is emasculating. I understand it’s not in most movies because of an MPAA thing but it’s actually the nice and loving part of sex that actually happens between real couples.

ES: Yes, that’s true. What I’m saying is unfortunately in certain circles still that can be seen by certain men as being emasculating. I mean, it’s a very small group I’m sure.

SG: Let’s tell them they’re wrong.

ES: [Laughs] Yes, of course. But I always like to include that as much as I can. I like to include in my films a sexuality that is exactly as you just described. One that we all know is common, lovely and important part of sexuality but that doesn’t get talked about or shown nearly enough. So whether that’s a man going down on a woman, whether that’s an intimacy discussed in a conversation about what people like and don’t like in their sex, I think that’s something that is important to me to put in my films. Also I think that scene makes sense storywise, that they’ve had such a tempestuous and sexually building emotional relationship to that point that it just explodes in a sexual way at that moment.

SG: Is “Where’s the cheese” the ultimate post coital line?

ES: [Laughs] I think it’s a pretty good one. I know after I quit smoking, food was probably the first thing I want to go to after the post coital cuddle. Generally it’s chocolate but in lieu of chocolate it would be cheese.

SG: Is Summer going to end happily?

ES: Well, I don't know yet. Spring comes first so in 15 years we’ll see what happens in Spring.

SG: But you’re moving into the happier seasons metaphorically. You’d hope the stories can get happier.

ES: Yes, of course I do. And Spring could be a prequel. Spring could be metaphoric for the springtime of his life. Maybe I won’t be in it and it’ll be about his character when he was in high school. I’ve played with that idea and then Summer, I don't know. In 30 years, God willing I’m able to make films and the gods allow. I would certainly like to not have the quartet be of tragic endings.

SG: What happens if in 2026 you get writers block?

ES: Well, I might not ever want to make another movie again starting tomorrow. So far in the last 20 years I’ve still been highly motivated and it’s been a fun endeavor. If I don’t, I guess I’ll just have to say the plan was to have four, but alas there’s only going to be two.

SG: Are you finished blogging your dating experiences?

ES: I blogged very specifically around the launch of my book because I wanted to have writing happening out in the world to set up my book and help people know about the book. So it was a very specific reason to blog then. I have been writing on a Tumblr blog for the last few months, which is Mrericschaeffer at Tumblr and that bounces out to Twitter and Facebook, because I again wanted to at least in a small way get some thoughts out there around this time. I am actually on the FilmBuff website going to start blogging about some of my favorite sex scenes in other films that have emotional impact and my experience in the world of love and dating as evidenced by certain scenes in my films. So over the next couple weeks and months I’m going to be blogging more with a specific design in mind.

SG: Online dating has gotten more sophisticated over the years. Do you still use it?

ES: I don’t. I think like most people I’ve had a love hate relationship with them. I also have a very specific theory, which is that quite honestly there are a higher level of, for lack of a better word, normal guys on there than women. I just think that smart, attractive, interesting women really don’t need to be on an internet dating site. I think that the way the world is constructed they are deluged with suitors in the real world. And while many of those suitors I’m sure are not interesting to those women, there’s got to be a high enough percentage of them that are when they’re approached in elevators, at the gym, at work, at Church, on the streets, at stoplights in their car in L.A. that they have enough on their plates to date. Whereas men, as we know, you can be relatively good looking and interesting and nice guy.

SG: Even successful.

ES: Even, successful even, and girls don’t come up and ask you out. So it makes sense for us to need to be on places that can widen the pool, widen our chances. So my experience has been that a lot of women that seem interesting on those dating websites, there’s some glitch. They’re lying, they already have boyfriends. I know for a fact, I met so many girls that I know have boyfriends and just keep their profiles up because they “want to just know that other guys think they’re cute.”

SG: I really like the questions eHarmony asks. It seems to get people talking and revealing really positive things. That said, though I've enjoyed looking through the profiles, I have not bothered to meet a single person in a year.

ES: Have you gotten any matches other than teachers?

SG: Yes. I would actually like a teacher or nurse’s personality.

ES: Again, nothing against teachers. Teachers are great people but it’s funny. I would just keep getting these sweater vest almost like Pat from SNL, 45-year-old teachers from the suburbs.

SG: I wonder if I did something wrong because last year the matches were more relevant. Now it’s like whoever they’ve got.

ES: That’s exactly right. You’re so right. There were a couple winners right in the beginning that make you think, “Oh my God.” I had the same experience. Then suddenly literally, nothing against any types of people, but specific types of

people that I said no to I would just get them.

SG: Did you ever try Jdate?

ES: I’m not Jewish but I did, and I didn’t lie. Because all my Jewish friends were like, “No, you don’t have to be Jewish.” I wrote in the book, I got set upon by 55-year-old cougar chicks from Long Island. It was insane and fantastic but didn’t pan out.

SG: JDate was the worst site I ever experienced.

ES: The hard thing about it is it’s very addictive and it’s very exciting because you have literally all these women that, and this is the problem, that you think are “like-minded” in that they’re not posturing. They’re there for one reason, to fall in love with you and for you to fall in love with them. You think everyone’s being honest and you have this dossier, you have this recipe book of exactly how you guys can work together but I just found that there was just a lot of bullshit. That they were just lying. There was a lot of lying or drug addicts and drunks.

SG: Fortunately I only had funny bad dates, no one dangerously addicted.

ES: I’m telling you, I met some crazy, crazy girls in there and that’s what I thought was so funny when people say whatever they want to say about me. It’s funny, a girl I met online when there was a lot of gossip stuff being written about me, of course they never tell the whole story. They only tell their side of it. So I’ve been off it for a couple years. I think that I’m done with that. It was an interesting foray but I think I’m going to leave it up to the fates.

SG: You’re referring to when people criticized you for saying you wouldn’t date an addict, or a woman too old to have kids. Don’t a lot of women insist on a certain height and that’s okay? What if I said I’m only going to date women with big breasts? That wouldn’t be okay but if you like a certain height so you can wear heals and he’s still taller, that’s not superficial?

ES: Listen, I’m 5’8.” I’m the average height of the American male. I’m not short, I’m not tall, I’m the average height. I can’t tell you, you know because you brought it up, I totally agree with you. That’s why I get so annoyed because we all just have preferences. Hey, some girls just want to date tall guys, God bless you. I don’t like to hear it and my line to them is always, “So if God comes down and says to you I have given you your soul mate. His name is Eric. You will live in happy joyous peace the rest of your lives.” What are you going to say, “Sorry God, he’s an inch and a half too short?” So like you don’t really want love. If you’re willing to not go out with me because you only go 5’10” so I’m too inches below that. That’s what I mean when people get so upset that I have such strict standards. They’re just preferences. They’re not absolutes. My absolutes are not to go out with someone who can’t have babies and who’s an active drug addict or a fucking alcoholic. That’s pretty much it. My preferences are what I like but does that mean I’ll give? Of course I’d give. An inch or two here or a pound or two there, who gives a fuck?

SG: It’s funny some superficial things are accepted and some are not.

ES: Yes, well, basically we know the answer to that. Women’s superficiality is accepted and a man’s superficiality makes him misogynistic. A woman’s superficiality makes you a woman.

SG: I should add, women have a lot more to deal with. I mean, this is Suicide Girls here. But we should end on something positive.

ES: No, I agree. I’m all about positivity.

SG: We should conclude that we believe romance will happen in the real world.

ES: It will, yes, I feel very strongly that that will happen for you.

SG: How is your dating life now?

ES: Well, listen. I feel very lucky that I seem to attract really, really high quality wonderful women into my life. So I definitely don’t have any dearth of women that I date that are really great women, but I haven’t had that just proper chemistry with so that they become a girlfriend in many years. So my dating life is great in that I meet a lot of women and they’re terrific women, but it’s not good in that I haven’t met one yet that I can commit with.

After Fall, Winter is playing in select cities now.

web address: http://suicidegirls.com/interviews/Eric+Schaeffer/