Arofish: Graffiti from Iraq through Palestine

Anyone else think this guy is really cool?

Yeah, he is.

Did he do any nice designs featuring Palestinians murdering civilians in nightclubs, buses, shopping malls and restaurants?

Nevermind. Don't want to get into [another] Israel - Palestine flame war/zot fest.


[Edited on Nov 19, 2004 by Keith]

edited in respect of ceasefire



[Edited on Nov 19, 2004 by Albion]

Albion and Keith: The Healing Begins.

Yeah he has been noted around in Isreal. I am involved in Urban Exploreing and this was shown on a thread.

The problem with the wall is it is more effective then the palestian's want to admit. The other problem is the wall is restrictive and prevents the palestians from ever getting a fair share of good lands.

Personally I hate the whole plaestian thing since they got shunned out every other nation and have a hap hazard claim. Anyways I think both sides are wrong on this topic.

I just wonder what would happen if, a thousand years from now, ten million American Indians tried to reclaim Rhode Island.

You think 10 million Jews suddenly returned to Israel?

I would think it would be a good thing for Native Americans to be given a small homeland in the States.

Let's say after years of violent hatred, enforced diaspora, religious persecution and large scale anihilation the Pequots started return to their traditional lands in Connecticut.

Let's say as soon as they started to return, the people of Connecticut started killing them again resulting in a war.

Let's say the Pequot managed to secure one fifth of Connecticut as a secure homeland. A place where they wouldn't be at risk from government and religious oppression ever again.

Let's say a whole bunch of white people from that area chose to leave, but weren't allowed to be absorbed into the remaining four fifths of Connecticut.

Let's say they were kept as permanent "refugees".

Let's say all the surrounding States started attacking the Pequot and the self-exiled white people started blowing up innocent civilian Pequots in restaurants, shopping malls and buses.

Let's say - ot of sheer desparation, after all efforts at maiking peace with the self-exiled white men had failed, the Pequot erected a wall to protect their men, women and children....

And let's say that naive apologists started slamming the Pequots for having the nerve to defend their men, women and children....and started doing one sided, ignorant and frankly rather dull, unartistic murals on the wall to try and make more naive apologists feel sorry for the self-exiled white men...

Would all that be a rather long winded analogy?

Well technically each reservation is there own country. I dont know how I feel aobut the whole Native American thing.

I get so mad when the we were slave card gets pulled out, by some lazy snot nosed kid. Every person in every country has been a slave at one time. Everyone has been repressed.

Back to topic. Albion I see what you are saying but its not that simple as it looks. Your point is good but it doesnt quite fit for the situation there. Its more like mexican americans getting a place in rode island, since we got texas from them.

In politics its more about whos on top, since every culture out there has been bashed one time or another. Giving back land taken would go on forever. The palestines would probably end up giving that land back to someone else who oppressed or removed before.

By the way the palestians are not free on that death and killing. Infact I think they started the death when they felt opressed, rightfully so.

It seems like a lot of people here want to fight for the under dog which is good. I just think its unfair to hate the Isreali's when they are doing the same thing the under dog does. I have heard both sides were at fault, but I think the first shots came from palestine rebels.

The Israel should never and will never withdraw from the occupied territories until it feels safe. The rest is up to the Palestinians. Do they want to live like this forever? If not then they have to stop threating Israel. Until then, Israel protects itself with walls, bulldozers and helicopter gunship strikes at Hamas leaders. Whatever it takes. To me this is crystal clear, but I fear it will take a few more millenia for it to sink into many Palestinian heads.

BTW - Jordan IS "Palestine".

I tend to agree with you Albion. Love the picture. I wonder how that looked for the last couple 100 years. Well time will tell. Picture is informative as well.

You're just jealous because I didn't choose you to be my role model.

You can see historical maps of the region and modern border changes at this web site


and to give you some sense of the scale...



[Edited on Nov 20, 2004 by Albion]

Yea, I can't agree with either of you. Why? Because neither one of you have any knowledge of the zionist revolution that took place in Europe prior to WWII, nor do you even know what took place durring WWII by zionists in order to create Isreal.

But you sure have the scewed version of history down pat. Things like:

"The Palistinians volunteered to leave Israel."

But it's alright, turn your back on genocide, it's not happening if the nations comitting it are saying it isn't. "They're just work camps".

okay buddy, this'll be interesting - why don't you explain it to us?

Ooooooooooooooooooookay. Another great heresy200 post.

Hey folks: you don't have to agree with or even LIKE Israel's policies to knw that what's going on there ain't genocide. But most of you knew that already.

If it isn't genocide what would you consider an appropriate term?

If what isn't "genocide"?

Also, where the fuck does he get "work camps" from?

if "what's going on there ain't genocide" what would you call "what's going on there"?

a bunch of fucking culties trying to murder Israeli civilians

the israeli army trying to stop them

And the israeli army has built a wall and bulldozed civilians houses and killed civilians. While I wouldn't call it genocide it might qualify for the term Apartheid?

I think what we have is both sides of the argument have picked a side in the conflict and are pretending that only one side is doing things wrong.

Which, admittedly, sucks.

All the same, though, I don't even know that Apartheid is a proper term...

Statements 2 and 3 are certainly valid, but I don't believe that Israel's actions, however flawed in many cases, are driven from a policy of deliberate discrimination toward Palestinian Arabs. If anything, I think Israel's track record toward Israeli Arabs has been rather good, right?

[Edited on Nov 20, 2004 by Phoebus]

Genocide

"The systematic and planned extermination of an entire national, racial, political, or ethnic group"

Israel attacks leaders of cult groups who order young men to kill Israeli men, women and children.

Israel attacks gun men firing at Israeli targets.

Israel attacks terrorists on missions

Ocassionally civilian palestinians who are used as human shields by terrorists get killed in the cross fire.

Some Palestinians are prematurely killed by their own bombs

What's happening? Israeli self defence, Palestinian cynical disregard for the safety of their own civilians, inept bomb making and...... according to the Palestinian Human Rights Monitoring Group - over 11% of Palestinians killed in their "intefada" are actually killed by other Palestinians.

Genocide would indicate a concerted Israeli attempt to wipe out the Palestinians. Perhaps that describes what Hamas are trying to do to the Jews. Unlike the IDF, the Palestinians actually aim to kill civilians.

Anyone who thinks Israel is trying to kill all the Palestinians is an idiot, a Jew Hater or both...