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martinj_b52

martinj_b52

I'm lost
December 2006

NOV 25, 2009 05:21 AM

Been saying this for years, only because I well remember when it was "Global Cooling" and the coming ice age. And before that, everyone was wringing their hands over the earthquake that was going to drop everything West of the San Andreas Fault into the ocean. There were even people who purchased large portions of real estate in the middle of nowhere, thinking that they were going to own beachfront property.
And now it comes out that the primary source for climate data has been fixing the data, or even threating amongst themselves to "rig" the data, apparently for status and financial gain.

I just think it is sad that only the bbc and fox news will carry the story, as usual. Al Gore pranks the world and gets away with it.

Elichrusos

Elichrusos

I'm lost
October 2007

NOV 25, 2009 05:26 AM

If only the BBC and Fox are coving the story, how did you link to the Telegraph?

MisterSatan

MisterSatan

Portland, OR
August 2002

NOV 25, 2009 05:31 AM

You're going to need a bit more than a link to some nut's blog on the Telegraph's site to back your claim up, sonny Jim. Ball's in your court- prove it.

Pip

Pip

Framingham, MA
OLD SKOOL

NOV 25, 2009 06:04 AM

It was one email about tweaking one graph. The actual science in the rest of the emails that were leaked is 100% legit. That of course is far more science than you are probably comfortable with.

IDGAS

IDGAS

Jackson Heights, NY
March 2004

NOV 25, 2009 06:05 AM

The New York Times reported the story on November 21, 2009.

Some of the correspondence portrays the scientists as feeling under siege by the skeptics’ camp and worried that any stray comment or data glitch could be turned against them.

The evidence pointing to a growing human contribution to global warming is so widely accepted that the hacked material is unlikely to erode the overall argument. However, the documents will undoubtedly raise questions about the quality of research on some specific questions and the actions of some scientists.

In several e-mail exchanges, Kevin Trenberth, a climatologist at the National Center for Atmospheric Research, and other scientists discuss gaps in understanding of recent variations in temperature. Skeptic Web sites pointed out one line in particular: “The fact is that we can’t account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can’t,” Dr. Trenberth wrote.

But several scientists and others contacted by The New York Times confirmed that they were the authors or recipients of specific e-mail messages included in the file. The revelations are bound to inflame the public debate as hundreds of negotiators prepare to negotiate an international climate accord at meetings in Copenhagen next month, and at least one scientist speculated that the timing was not coincidental.

Dr. Trenberth said Friday that he was appalled at the release of the e-mail messages.

But he added that he thought the revelations might backfire against climate skeptics. He said that he thought that the messages showed “the integrity of scientists.” Still, some of the comments might lend themselves to being interpreted as sinister.

In a 1999 e-mail exchange about charts showing climate patterns over the last two millenniums, Phil Jones, a longtime climate researcher at the East Anglia Climate Research Unit, said he had used a “trick” employed by another scientist, Michael Mann, to “hide the decline” in temperatures.

At issue were sets of data, both employed in two studies. One data set showed long-term temperature effects on tree rings; the other, thermometer readings for the past 100 years.

Through the last century, tree rings and thermometers show a consistent rise in temperature until 1960, when some tree rings, for unknown reasons, no longer show that rise, while the thermometers continue to do so until the present.

Dr. Mann explained that the reliability of the tree-ring data was called into question, so they were no longer used to track temperature fluctuations. But he said dropping the use of the tree rings was never something that was hidden, and had been in the scientific literature for more than a decade. “It sounds incriminating, but when you look at what you’re talking about, there’s nothing there,” Dr. Mann said.

In addition, other independent but indirect measurements of temperature fluctuations in the studies broadly agreed with the thermometer data showing rising temperatures.


Of course not all scientists - most - who argue for global warming wrote these emails but in the world of martinj_b52 a few is good enough. This is just like how all solders, sailors and Marines intentionally kill non-combatants.

martinj_b52

martinj_b52

I'm lost
December 2006

NOV 25, 2009 06:13 AM

Well, Okay. First there was this: and for Elichrusos, this, and I would quote Fox news, or Hannity, or LImbaugh with his precious 98% self-proclaimed accuracy rate, or Glenn Beck, but a lot of the people on this forum seem to put all of those in with Fox, so I wont waste your time with all of those.

motorfirebox

motorfirebox

Pittsburgh, PA
March 2004

NOV 25, 2009 06:23 AM

oh, well thanks for that. i'd hate to think you're wasting our time.

Elichrusos

Elichrusos

I'm lost
October 2007

NOV 25, 2009 06:24 AM

Just, fyi, "with his precious 98% self-proclaimed accuracy rate" sounds like a parody.

Also, my point was more that if you're linking to the telegraphs website, the BBC and Fox aren't the only one's who noticed it.

martinj_b52

martinj_b52

I'm lost
December 2006

NOV 25, 2009 06:35 AM

Elichrusos said:
Just, fyi, "with his precious 98% self-proclaimed accuracy rate" sounds like a parody.

Also, my point was more that if you're linking to the telegraphs website, the BBC and Fox aren't the only one's who noticed it.



But the telegraph's site, as noted by satan, is a blog. So I provided the others, just for the support he wanted.

gdarklighter

gdarklighter

San Diego, CA
August 2005

NOV 25, 2009 08:23 AM

Pip said:
It was one email about tweaking one graph. The actual science in the rest of the emails that were leaked is 100% legit. That of course is far more science than you are probably comfortable with.


And the supposedly damning email was really just about putting the data in a context that explained a deviation from their expected results. This is par for the course in all fields, and while it's unfortunate that casual conversations among researchers look shady to the lay person, there's nothing untoward going on with the research.

Otoki

Otoki

SUICIDEGIRL

Minnesota, USA

NOV 25, 2009 09:18 AM

Judging from the posts I can actually see, the ignore button is saving me from a headache. I suggest people utilize it.

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

NOV 25, 2009 09:19 AM

Otoki said:
Judging from the posts I can actually see, the ignore button is saving me from a headache. I suggest people utilize it.



Better than aspirin with a bourbon chaser.

mydogfarted

mydogfarted

Oakland, NJ
June 2003

NOV 25, 2009 09:27 AM

martinj_b52 said:
LImbaugh with his precious 98% self-proclaimed accuracy rate,



I would like to proclaim that I have the biggest penis ever. Now it must be fact, right?

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

NOV 25, 2009 09:37 AM

mydogfarted said:

martinj_b52 said:
LImbaugh with his precious 98% self-proclaimed accuracy rate,



I would like to proclaim that I have the biggest penis ever. Now it must be fact, right?



I believe there is someone on this site we can use as a factchecker.

khoos

khoos

HOPEFUL

Ottawa, ON

NOV 25, 2009 09:40 AM

Coyotemike said:

mydogfarted said:

martinj_b52 said:
LImbaugh with his precious 98% self-proclaimed accuracy rate,



I would like to proclaim that I have the biggest penis ever. Now it must be fact, right?



I believe there is someone on this site we can use as a factchecker.



In order for me to check this fact I need to see all the penises ever?
(ok, maybe just a few more)

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

NOV 25, 2009 09:42 AM

khoos said:

Coyotemike said:

mydogfarted said:

martinj_b52 said:
LImbaugh with his precious 98% self-proclaimed accuracy rate,



I would like to proclaim that I have the biggest penis ever. Now it must be fact, right?



I believe there is someone on this site we can use as a factchecker.



In order for me to check this fact I need to see all the penises ever?
(ok, maybe just a few more)



What, are you too busy? tongue

McKenneth

McKenneth

Macedon, NY
August 2005

NOV 25, 2009 09:46 AM

martinj_b52 said:
I would quote Fox news, or Hannity... or Glenn Beck, but a lot of the people on this forum seem to put all of those in with Fox, so I wont waste your time with all of those.



You know why we do that?

SPOILERS! (Click to view)
BECAUSE THEY FUCKING WORK FOR FOX NEWS.



Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

NOV 25, 2009 09:48 AM

McKenneth said:

martinj_b52 said:
I would quote Fox news, or Hannity... or Glenn Beck, but a lot of the people on this forum seem to put all of those in with Fox, so I wont waste your time with all of those.



You know why we do that?

SPOILERS! (Click to view)
BECAUSE THEY FUCKING WORK FOR FOX NEWS.





Stop using facts, you'll just confuse him.

betterthantv

betterthantv

Conyers, GA
March 2008

NOV 25, 2009 09:53 AM

martinj_b52 said:
Been saying this for years, only because I well remember when it was "Global Cooling" and the coming ice age. And before that, everyone was wringing their hands over the earthquake that was going to drop everything West of the San Andreas Fault into the ocean. There were even people who purchased large portions of real estate in the middle of nowhere, thinking that they were going to own beachfront property.
And now it comes out that the primary source for climate data has been fixing the data, or even threating amongst themselves to "rig" the data, apparently for status and financial gain.

I just think it is sad that only the bbc and fox news will carry the story, as usual. Al Gore pranks the world and gets away with it.



This Thanksgiving I am thankful for people like you! I thought I was the only one who didn't believe in this whole Global Warming oops I mean Climate Change BS. Al Gore is the biggest prank the world has ever seen! And it's all about to unravel. I love it!biggrin

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

NOV 25, 2009 09:57 AM

betterthantv said:

martinj_b52 said:
Been saying this for years, only because I well remember when it was "Global Cooling" and the coming ice age. And before that, everyone was wringing their hands over the earthquake that was going to drop everything West of the San Andreas Fault into the ocean. There were even people who purchased large portions of real estate in the middle of nowhere, thinking that they were going to own beachfront property.
And now it comes out that the primary source for climate data has been fixing the data, or even threating amongst themselves to "rig" the data, apparently for status and financial gain.

I just think it is sad that only the bbc and fox news will carry the story, as usual. Al Gore pranks the world and gets away with it.



This Thanksgiving I am thankful for people like you! I thought I was the only one who didn't believe in this whole Global Warming oops I mean Climate Change BS. Al Gore is the biggest prank the world has ever seen! And it's all about to unravel. I love it!biggrin



How is the fact that the trees that are supposed to filter out CO2 from the atmosphere are constantly being cut down going to "unravel'? I thought you said you "thought for yourself"?

Rafi

Rafi

Santa Monica, CA
January 2003
Adroitbeing

Adroitbeing

I'm lost
September 2003

NOV 25, 2009 10:25 AM

betterthantv said:

martinj_b52 said:
Been saying this for years, only because I well remember when it was "Global Cooling" and the coming ice age. And before that, everyone was wringing their hands over the earthquake that was going to drop everything West of the San Andreas Fault into the ocean. There were even people who purchased large portions of real estate in the middle of nowhere, thinking that they were going to own beachfront property.
And now it comes out that the primary source for climate data has been fixing the data, or even threating amongst themselves to "rig" the data, apparently for status and financial gain.

I just think it is sad that only the bbc and fox news will carry the story, as usual. Al Gore pranks the world and gets away with it.



This Thanksgiving I am thankful for people like you! I thought I was the only one who didn't believe in this whole Global Warming oops I mean Climate Change BS. Al Gore is the biggest prank the world has ever seen! And it's all about to unravel. I love it!biggrin



Care to place a modest wager regarding the accuracy and quality of your assertion?

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

NOV 25, 2009 10:46 AM

bean

bean

STAFF

Los Angeles, CA

NOV 25, 2009 10:57 AM

Worth noting, for those who are honestly open to all sides of the story, and might be looking for some context: the scientists at RealClimate respond.

TheFuckOffKid

TheFuckOffKid

NEWSWIRE

Australia

NOV 25, 2009 11:54 AM

IDGAS said:
The New York Times reported the story on November 21, 2009.


Pathetic, isn't it? I read this in the fucking airport on my way home from NYC on the weekend.

But apparently only Fox News and the BBC really carried it. Or something.

Martini is back, confused as ever.

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