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cthulhu

cthulhu

Miami Beach, FL
April 2008

JUN 11, 2008 09:24 AM

WTF is up with these Dems?! They're going to fuck it all up and we're going to be stuck with 4 more years of Bush-esque gov't.!

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(CNN) _ On the same day Democratic leaders stressed party unity after the drawn out primary fight, one congressional Democrat said Tuesday he will not endorse Barack Obama's bid for the White House.

Rep. Dan Boren, Oklahoma's lone Democrat in Congress, told the Associated Press Obama is "the most liberal senator," and said he has to listen to the wishes of his own constituents.

"We're much more conservative," Boren said of his rural district which stretches across the eastern part of the state and borders Kansas, Missouri, Arkansas, and Texas.

"I've got to reflect my district. No one means more to me than the people who elected me. I have to listen to them," Boren added. His congressional office confirmed the accuracy of the quotes to CNN.

Boren also said Obama's record "does not reflect working in a bipartisan fashion." But the Oklahoma Democrat said he would vote for Obama at the party's convention in August because of the serious issues the country faces.

"I think this is an important time for our country," he said. "We're facing a terrible economic downturn. We have high gasoline prices. We have problems in our foreign policy. That's why I think it's important."

Boren's comments come a day after Florida Democratic Rep. Tim Mahoney also said he has no plans to make a formal endorsement. The freshman Democrat, who replaced Republican Rep. Mark Foley following House page scandal, told the Palm Beach Post he plans on remaining an uncommitted superdelegate and may not even attend the convention.

Source: http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...endorse-obama/

-Cthulhu

Hooraydiation

Hooraydiation

Boston, MA
October 2005

JUN 11, 2008 09:29 AM

It's just one guy, and he's still going to vote for him.

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

JUN 11, 2008 09:29 AM

So . . . you're pissed because a member of Congress is doing the job he was elected to do, namely represent the opinions and wishes of the people who elected him?

Hooraydiation

Hooraydiation

Boston, MA
October 2005

JUN 11, 2008 09:30 AM

coyotemike said:
So . . . you're pissed because a member of Congress is doing the job he was elected to do, namely represent the opinions and wishes of the people who elected him?



Are endorsements meant to be representative of the will of constituents?

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

JUN 11, 2008 09:32 AM

Hooraydiation said:

coyotemike said:
So . . . you're pissed because a member of Congress is doing the job he was elected to do, namely represent the opinions and wishes of the people who elected him?



Are endorsements meant to be representative of the will of constituents?



Ideally, everything a representative does in an official capacity should be the will of the constituents.

cpkz

cpkz

Portland, OR
September 2006

JUN 11, 2008 09:50 AM

coyotemike said:

Hooraydiation said:

coyotemike said:
So . . . you're pissed because a member of Congress is doing the job he was elected to do, namely represent the opinions and wishes of the people who elected him?



Are endorsements meant to be representative of the will of constituents?



Ideally, everything a representative does in an official capacity should be the will of the constituents.



Yeah, I actually have to pat him on the back. If more representatives presented their attitude as such, that they are doing what they believe their constituency wants, I wouldn't go into a feral rage every time someone calls America a Democracy.

As long as our representatives do what they want as opposed to the will of their people, we are a Republic.

cthulhu

cthulhu

Miami Beach, FL
April 2008

JUN 11, 2008 09:55 AM

"Feral rage" is a bit much. I just hope the party comes together so they can run an effective race against McCain. I'm not angry or in rage. I don't agree with a two party system, but until there is an effective way to really change policy and make it a truer democracy I think we need to actively engage the candidates we are presented with and challenge them to reform the political system.

Hooraydiation

Hooraydiation

Boston, MA
October 2005

JUN 11, 2008 10:01 AM

What's the point of an endorsement, if not to convince people who might otherwise be unsupportive of a man or woman's candidacy to vote for him or her?

cpkz

cpkz

Portland, OR
September 2006

JUN 11, 2008 10:46 AM

cthulhu said:
"Feral rage" is a bit much. I just hope the party comes together so they can run an effective race against McCain. I'm not angry or in rage. I don't agree with a two party system, but until there is an effective way to really change policy and make it a truer democracy I think we need to actively engage the candidates we are presented with and challenge them to reform the political system.



It wasn't so bad...until, y'know, George W. Bush won the presidency despite losing the majority vote, and probably even the electoral college. That wouldn't even have done it for me, if he didn't immediately proceed to try to spread "Democracy" to other nations.

The going around mass slaughtering people to spread 'Democracy' from a country that obviously lacks the very 'democratic' structure it believes in moved me from "slight anger" to "rage."

Mr_Matt_

Mr_Matt_

Pompano Beach, FL
July 2005

JUN 11, 2008 11:35 AM

This is Oklahoma you're talking about. Consider it a lost cause.

bean

bean

STAFF

Los Angeles, CA

JUN 11, 2008 11:59 AM

The best thing to come out of Boren's non-endorsement is this Daily Kos article: The Final Battle. Now With Deflowered Virgins

It's hilarious and brilliant. I'll excerpt for an introduction, but read the article for the really funny bits.

So here's my gentle question for Rep. Boren. Let's just suppose that he was right, and Obama really was "the most liberal senator" in the entire Democratic contingent -- a term magically conferred by conservatives on whatever figure wins the nomination, election after election, while hyper-mega-death-penalty-mocking-war-humping-salmon-punching-archconservative Republicans magically turn into "moderates", using those same conservatives' exact same terribly objective calculations for such things.

So let's just stipulate that someone might be "the most liberal" senator. My question for Rep. Boren, and for his Oklahoma constituents, is this: so what? So what if someone is a "liberal"?

What exactly are you afraid of?



Seriously, I had tears in my eyes reading it, from laughing so hard. Skim it, if you must, but you'd be doing yourself a disservice to ignore it.

Quirky

Quirky

Birmingham, AL
October 2005

JUN 11, 2008 12:09 PM

Mr_Matt_ said:
This is Oklahoma you're talking about. Consider it a lost cause.



Classy attitude.

gdarklighter

gdarklighter

San Diego, CA
August 2005

JUN 11, 2008 01:31 PM

Mr_Matt_ said:
This is Oklahoma you're talking about. Consider it a lost cause.


Obama doesn't; why should we?

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

JUN 11, 2008 01:43 PM

Did anybody else note that he still intends to vote for Obama during the convention? He isn't doing anything to divide the party, he's just listening to the winds that blow from his state. Maybe.

I wonder if he is up for reelection this fall . . . that may explain the strategy for being a Democrat in a red state.

NarcissistZero

NarcissistZero

Philadelphia, PA
December 2005

JUN 11, 2008 01:45 PM

It's not his lack of support that is telling, it's his making a point of it. Obama is indeed further left than most democrats, and he does have a lot of haters inside the party because of Hillary's defeat and the Reverend Wright shit, so... we'll be seeing a lot more of this before November, I imagine.

That said, I still think he can win... McCain is a boob.

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

JUN 11, 2008 01:52 PM

NarcissistZero said:
It's not his lack of support that is telling, it's his making a point of it. Obama is indeed further left than most democrats, and he does have a lot of haters inside the party because of Hillary's defeat and the Reverend Wright shit, so... we'll be seeing a lot more of this before November, I imagine.

That said, I still think he can win... McCain is a boob.



Further left than which democrats? Ben Nelson? Yes. Dennis Kusinich? No. He's pretty much in the middle of the pack.

NarcissistZero

NarcissistZero

Philadelphia, PA
December 2005

JUN 11, 2008 01:56 PM

coyotemike said:

NarcissistZero said:
It's not his lack of support that is telling, it's his making a point of it. Obama is indeed further left than most democrats, and he does have a lot of haters inside the party because of Hillary's defeat and the Reverend Wright shit, so... we'll be seeing a lot more of this before November, I imagine.

That said, I still think he can win... McCain is a boob.



Further left than which democrats? Ben Nelson? Yes. Dennis Kusinich? No. He's pretty much in the middle of the pack.



Further left than the average... I think it's obvious, but if you want to disagree then ok. I'm not going to debate it.

Mr_Matt_

Mr_Matt_

Pompano Beach, FL
July 2005

JUN 11, 2008 02:45 PM

Big_McLargehuge said:

Mr_Matt_ said:
This is Oklahoma you're talking about. Consider it a lost cause.



Classy attitude.



Oklahoma will go to McCain. It's about as red as they get. Therefore why worry about who endorses who there.

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

JUN 11, 2008 02:48 PM

NarcissistZero said:

coyotemike said:

NarcissistZero said:
It's not his lack of support that is telling, it's his making a point of it. Obama is indeed further left than most democrats, and he does have a lot of haters inside the party because of Hillary's defeat and the Reverend Wright shit, so... we'll be seeing a lot more of this before November, I imagine.

That said, I still think he can win... McCain is a boob.



Further left than which democrats? Ben Nelson? Yes. Dennis Kusinich? No. He's pretty much in the middle of the pack.



Further left than the average... I think it's obvious, but if you want to disagree then ok. I'm not going to debate it.



When someone says something is "obvious," it usually isnt.

Coyotemike

Coyotemike

USA
May 2006

JUN 11, 2008 02:54 PM

Mr_Matt_ said:

Big_McLargehuge said:

Mr_Matt_ said:
This is Oklahoma you're talking about. Consider it a lost cause.



Classy attitude.



Oklahoma will go to McCain. It's about as red as they get. Therefore why worry about who endorses who there.



So is my state, but I'm still going to vote for Obama and try to get others to do the same. Writing off a couple million people is a mistake.

Quirky

Quirky

Birmingham, AL
October 2005

JUN 11, 2008 02:59 PM

Mr_Matt_ said:

Big_McLargehuge said:

Mr_Matt_ said:
This is Oklahoma you're talking about. Consider it a lost cause.



Classy attitude.



Oklahoma will go to McCain. It's about as red as they get. Therefore why worry about who endorses who there.



It must be so nice to be clairvoyant.

bean

bean

STAFF

Los Angeles, CA

JUN 11, 2008 03:01 PM

Mr_Matt_ said:

Big_McLargehuge said:

Mr_Matt_ said:
This is Oklahoma you're talking about. Consider it a lost cause.



Classy attitude.



Oklahoma will go to McCain. It's about as red as they get. Therefore why worry about who endorses who there.


"Consider it a lost cause" is a very different statement from "why worry about who endorses who there."

The latter is a valid (if shortsighted) position, but the former implies that we should write off the state altogether, as though the very same 50-state strategy that helps Democrats make incremental progress in red states should be abandoned simply because a majority of people in the state are registered Republicans. Given the successes of that strategy, suggesting abandoning a state isn't a very popular position to take.

In short, I've got two words to describe why "consider it a lost cause" is a stupid thing to say:

Down ticket.

Mr_Matt_

Mr_Matt_

Pompano Beach, FL
July 2005

JUN 11, 2008 07:35 PM

Well, we weren't talking about local races, we were talking about

WTF is up with these Dems?! They're going to fuck it all up and we're going to be stuck with 4 more years of Bush-esque gov't.!

as noted in the OP.

Sure, state and local races are more heavily impacted by an endorsement by a Congressman. But it's not the argument I was making.

As far as

Democrats make incremental progress in red states should be abandoned simply because a majority of people in the state are registered Republicans. Given the successes of that strategy, suggesting abandoning a state isn't a very popular position to take.



goes, candidates in the general election abandon states all the time. It's a matter of time and resource allocation, not regional snubbery. (Although the whole "Massachusetts liberal" thing was, and it pissed me off.)

Hooraydiation

Hooraydiation

Boston, MA
October 2005

JUN 11, 2008 08:38 PM

14 Republican members of Congress refuse to endorse or support McCain.

Really puts this whole thing into perspective, doesn't it?

cpkz

cpkz

Portland, OR
September 2006

JUN 12, 2008 09:17 PM

Hooraydiation said:
14 Republican members of Congress refuse to endorse or support McCain.

Really puts this whole thing into perspective, doesn't it?



I like perspective.

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