$3.00 a gallon

Heard gas prices might reach as high as $3.00 a gallon during the summer rush. Am I the only one out there who doesn't think this would be a bad thing? Get on your bike! Walk!

I'd love to see gas prices right up around $7.00 a gallon. See how creative the American public can get when traditional transportation gets too expensive.

And yeah I drive, but if I really had to be somewhere, I'd be willing to scrape up the money for gas or I'd find some other way to get there.

What do you think?

[Edited on Mar 07, 2003 by Grendel]

I see where you're coming from and in some ways, it's a nice thought. I'd be pleased if people didn't drive as much as they do. Unfortunately, I think there'd be concequences all over the place. The higher cost of shipping would be reflected in the price of goods, the whole economy would suffer and hasten my decent into poverty. Besides, I have a knee-jerk reaction against artificially manipulating prices in order to change peoples behavior.

If gas is $7.00 per gallon, who gets to keep all the extra money? If the answer is me, then I've changed my mind and I'm all for it.

Yeah, I can also see where you're coming from with the economic downward spiral 7 dollar gas might cause, but the romantic in me just wants to belive that if gas prices really did reach those levels that there would be an increased push and demand for alternative energy sources or more fuel efficient cars.

People might decide that 12 mpg really is kind of shitty even if you do get to drive around in a big bad ass SUV.

I've sort of always thought that fossil fuel dependancy is at the heart of a lot of what's wrong with a lot of societies.

Ugh, is that my heart bleeding?

*<

[Edited on Jun 22, 2003 by BlixaSinister]

My milk costs like $2 a gallon. I've seen gas prices higher. Hey what if we goto war with iraq and since we can't seem to aim are missiles enough to not hot civillians all over the place maybe we'll hit some oil field igniting the crude oil and destroying a fair portion of the oil supply and the machinery(also causing ecological havoc) Then $7 a gallon might be low in comparision to how high they would rocket in the initial scare. That would be nifty.

I don't think petroleum dependancy is the problem. I think human's are at the heart of a lot of what's wrong with a lot of societies. If it weren't for petroleum, we'd find something else to fight about and accidentally dump in the ocean.

I really love internal combustion. Engines can be amazing and lovely things. It's just a bummer that there are so many of them running all the time.


why the hell am I still up?.... good night.

Grendel said:
People might decide that 12 mpg really is kind of shitty even if you do get to drive around in a big bad ass SUV.

kind of shitty? it's horrible!
they've come up with engines that can go 100km on 3 litres of gasoline, which is roughly 63 miles on two-thirds of a gallon.

but someone please tell what the point is driving a huge SUV in the middle of downtown?
"the road might turn into a mountain trail at the next light!"
not to go on an american-bashing rampage here, but you merkins would be able to cut down your oil imports to practicly nil if you'd start driving cars that had better mileage. then you'd be able to play world-police without people thinking you were just at to get oil

I've sort of always thought that fossil fuel dependancy is at the heart of a lot of what's wrong with a lot of societies.

not sure about that, but it's at the heart of what's happening to the environment today.

Ugh, is that my heart bleeding?

damned liberal

The eventual depletion of oil supplies may well be the most serious long term problem we face (ironic isn't it considering the amount of environmental damage done by fossil fuels?). Although, we may start feeling the effects of a peak in oil production in a few years time.

If we do no come up with a good alternative energy source in the next decade or two our very form of civilization may well be threatened. Like past civilizations that ran out of crucial resources (good soil, trees), the modern industrial age may come to a grinding, screeching halt. And that would be quite the nightmare scenario (intensified wars, downspiraling economies, etc.). The sooner we find and fully implement a new energy source the better. Let's hope it's a clean one, too.

For a sobering report on this dire problem watch this video of a lecture by a petroleum geologist who gives good statistics on when the oil is likely to run out and why and how countries are falsely raising and claiming higher amounts of oil reserves: The End of the Age of Oil

Note: The lecture begins with an introduction in German, but the main speaker will talk in English.

Should the prices get up around 7 a gallon it would completely kill the tourism and travel industries for the summer. No one wants to trek across country in the family truckster when it costs $120 to fill the gas tank. A lot of towns would be hurting real bad if this were to happen. Airline tickets would sky rocket too. Boating would probably be killed off.

The price of damn near everything would soar. Shipping costs, as has been pointed out, would drive many proces through the roof. But you'd also have people thinking, "hey, everyone else is rasing their prices, why not us".

If it stayed that high for long enough there would have to be a huge increase in the federal minimum wage. This would cause many small businesses some serious damage. Do you think your locally owned book or msic store can afford to pay its people $12-15/hr? (yes, I am making that up, but the $7/gallon is a 400% increase roughly, whereas this estimate is a 250-300%, seems reasonable).

Basically, as much as some of you may want to help the environment by encouraging people to walk, ride bikes, or some other environmentally friendly mode of transportation, the damage that would be done by such a swift raise in prices would be insurmountable.

the biggest problem we face is overpopulation. the average person (read: american) may not see the effects of population growth, but in a relatively short period of time it will be impossible to ignore. the world population doubles every 40 years. for the US, considering the land mass and natural resources, the maximum sustainability is 200 million and we're already approaching 300 million. in short, we're fucked

(sorry, i'm venting....today, i got crowded and suffered a slight panic attack in a grocery store line when an extremely rude individual slammed into me with their cart.....AND on my way out an SUV ran a stop sign and almost hit me!) more people = more assholes

Where did you pull that number for the carrying capacity of the US from? I can see how you can get the impression that the US is overpopulated if you live on the coasts, but large parts of the rural interior are nearly depopulated because of people moving to the coasts. Overpopulation is typically a serious local problem in certain areas, not a national one.

And in reality, it's not even a global one. According to the worst case scenarios from the UN World Population Fund, human population will not double again, and according to the middling scenarios, may not even crest 10 billion. The key thing to realize is that as socio-economic status and in particular the status of women in society rises, birthrates fall. Most of the industrialized world now has a birthrate below replacement levels. The US population continues to grow only because of immigration -- if we sealed the borders, the US population would slowly begin to fall.

It's very obvious you dont live in los angeles.

rileycat said:

What about all those european countries that are smaller then most us states that have near the population. the us ranks in 3rd for pop and land mass, whereas japan ranks in 9th in world pop. but 61 for land mass. Germany is 12th for pop. but 62 for land mass. the us is very sparsely populated, it's not so much our amount of land and rescouces but our ineffcient use of them. Like SUV's all my friends from europe comment on how huge are cars are. As the worlds oil supply runs out one day it will hit the us the worst and we will probaly turn into a third world county in a matter of weeks. SWEET Thunderdome time.

Damn, what a crazy idea. . . . .

People come up with ideas for new, more efficient forms of energy and transportation every once in a while. Generally speaking, the Big Industries try to keep an eye on this sort of thing and, when something starts to look like it might actually work, they usually buy the idea, copyright it and then sit on it. Those ideas might come back in time but not before Big Industry decides its time. And by then, the time it would have taken to refine these ideas will have past. . . . .it may be too little too late. Hmmmm, you know, some people accuse me of being too dramatic or fatalistic. . . . .I wonder what they mean.

[Edited on Mar 07, 2003 by Anger]

and! has anyone heard about the doller dropping?
Imports now more expensive, if it keeps dropping the economy will suffer due to other countries pulling out of the import/export business.
(i just heard about this so don't kill me if things have changed, i kind of live in a cave)
so the value of the doller alongside the Euro is kind of bad.
good time to buy american goods.
good time forBiodiesel good time for walking.
HAH! talk about recycling!

The idea of walking and public transportation is great if you live in a city
(City= something like SF where all your needs can be met inside the city)
as opposed to a town like here where i have to go grocery shopping in (nearly) a differant county.
(it's on the border)
the solution to that is having groceries delivered but that is a van that uses more gas and costs me 10.00 for the trip.
i don't know what i'm saying here. bleah. sorry

3$ a gallon? Damn thats cheap...

Right now I pay 1.12€ / 1.23$ per litre/ 0.264gal. That is 4.66$ per gallon...

You don't eat Dairy cattle, just wanted to point that out. You eat Beef cattle, which are raised for that sole purpose. Then again..McDonalds might actually use dairy cows, explaining why they have horrible tasting meat.

Anyways,if gas does go way up, it will hopefully convince the car industry to quit holding off on more economic models. I think a few countries have had them for years, I know Japan definatly has. I am glad to see in the past few years that they are producing more hybrid cars in the US.

Hopefully at some point they will build a hybrid SUV style vehicle for those who do require a larger vehicle or at least think they do. I know I don't want to ever drive a gas guzzling whore who farts emissions like mad.

Hopefully the weather gets nice soon so I can just take my bike or hoof it most everywhere instead.

Gas prices won't determine this. Consumer gas spending will.

Oh I would flunk out of school cause I wouldn't be able to pay for the tank of gas I spend getting 2 and from....and I thinkt hat if i was to take the bus to school it would take 3 hours....as where it only takes 45 min to drive there....I would be a college drop out

I'm a freelance soundtech, when the work arises. I personally drive an SUV because it's the only type of car that can hold all of the video, audio, and lighting equpiment while seating a cameraman, audio tech, producer, and ocassional talent. I think a lot of people drive them because they need to haul shit. Although I'm sure there are plenty of people who just like big cars. Oh, and my car is a 99' with 20,000 miles on it.

i "pulled" the number for the carrying capacity from Gaylord Nelson, the founder of Earth Day. he, along with a group of scientists, natural resource managers, ecologists, blah, blah held a panel discussion. when i referred to carrying capacity i wasn't simply speaking in terms of x amount of people physically fitting on a chunk of land, if i had, the world is doing fine....just stick all the newbies in the desert what i meant to say, but so poorly expressed is that if one considers the amount of resources required to sustain life, every individual requires a minimal amount of land or you can think of it in terms of every individual puts a certain burden on the land. so even if everyone moves to the coasts, the interior of the nation is still going to be affected. much like affects of pollution, population growth isn't something that can be thought of as "localized", it will be far-reaching. alright i'm bored....

as for "world population", even if the population doesn't double, aren't we already fucked? i put a "footprint" quiz on the boards a while back...check it out. i'd link ya, but i'm too lazy. i agree with what you had said about immigration but even if that were to stop, which it won't, do you actually believe that the current US population isn't going to completely obliterate our natural resources anyways? the whole SUV thing isn't just a trend... it's a symbol of our nation's arrogance, ignorance and irresponsiblity. we think we're above, perhaps immune, to the rest of the world's problems (even though we're the cause of so many of them..5% of the world's population responsible for 25% of CO2 emissions). one of the biggest issues is complacency. people like to hear scientists say anything as long as it enables them to live just as they have been living...it provides an absolution from their sins. alright now i'm really bored. i'm not a conversation person, in fact, i always slept through those classes preferring animal physiology... this is the most i've ever said about the environment and it is always the last. i initially wrote on this board because i'm not too fond of people, especially yuppies...hence my diatribe about overpopuation.

Wasn't that the same Gaylord Nelson who predicted exhaustion of oil supplies and mass starvation in the industrialized world by 1990? Excuse me if I take his pronouncements with a large grain of salt. And I do know what carrying capacity is, and how tricky it can be to calculate when you add advancing technology into the mix.

this is getting out of hand
let's go ride a bike

Thank you for posting from the civilized world. I get so sick of americans whining about gas prices and how the economy will suffer. this economy is a joke. its built on unnecessary demands created by propaganda and on ridiculous tax subsidies and wage slavery. the minimum wage is criminal, as is the education system.

and what should happen if the bubble bursts, will we have to live as they do in countries that dont 20x consume per individual the way we do here so ignorantly and callously..? oh no, i can hear the moaning already.

maybe, just maybe, pricing the gallon for its cost as they do in the rest of the world might not be a bad thing.

i dont see mass hate protests against any other country but the US... why..?



[Edited on Mar 07, 2003 by nobody]