Over the past 15 years Richard Linklater has turned into one of the great American film auteurs. His last few years have been his most exciting artistically and financially. School of Rock was his biggest hit and he followed that up with Before Sunset for which he was nominated for an Academy Award. Now comes his adaptation of Philip K. Dicks novel A Scanner Darkly which utilizes the computer rotoscoping he first experimented with in Waking Life. A Scanner Darkly stars Keanu Reeves as Bob Arctor, a man so far undercover within a group of junkies addicted to Substance D that he no longer knows what is real and what isnt. It also reteams him with his Dazed and Confused co-star Rory Cochrane. I got a chance to talk with Linklater about maneuvering with the Hollywood studio system, why rotoscoping works and the amazing Criterion Collection Director Approved DVD version of Dazed and Confused.
Check out the official website for A Scanner Darkly
Daniel Robert Epstein: Many of the scenes in A Scanner Darkly reminded me of my friends and I sitting around getting high. We would turn to the person we knew the least and go, You know what, youre a narc.
Richard Linklater: [laughs] This book was a little autobiographical for Philip K. Dick because at one point his family moved out and these guys moved in. It was sort of an open door policy. The people he loved were coming by and he was the host of his house. He was witty, smart and he told long stories. There were a lot of people around and he grew suspicious, especially at this time in history, that there were people around who were undercover.
DRE: In the respect of people just randomly coming by and crashing in his house, sounds like it could be autobiographical for you as well.
RL: That was me in the 80s. We all have that point in our lives. We left the front door open so people could just come in any time.
DRE: Was that in your mind when you were making this movie?
RL: It was probably in my mind as I approached the novel as something I could make into a movie. I think before you take something like that on you better feel that it is yours. There were a lot of elements that made me think, This is the Philip K. Dick novel that I could make a movie out of. Theres probably a lot of his books I couldnt, but I felt I knew these people. I knew this worked and I felt that I had a handle on it.
DRE: When you watched a scene in a movie before you guys rotoscoped how did that differ from when you watched a scene once you added the animation?
RL: The scenes without animation seemed very literal. Film is a pretty blunt instrument. This whole story exists in an altered state of being and consciousness. It definitely now has a lack of reality. In my mind, it didnt work near as well live action, there are a lot of elements that would have stood out.
DRE: Is there a future for rotoscoping besides commercials and what you do?
RL: I think people will always try to tell stories in ways that they think work for the story. Its an interesting time for animation. If theres anything going on I think its the home computer animation. Not the Pixar version because thats pretty far out of reach for everybody but more along the lines of indie animation. Adult animation is a marginalized world which is not taken too seriously in the same way that Philip K. Dicks sci-fi writing was maybe not taken too serious. In its day there was a sophisticated type of person who would look down their nose at it. That same person would look at the animation and not see what it is trying to do.
DRE: Philip K. Dicks work seems just as relevant now as it ever did.
RL: Yeah I think so. I think time has been nothing but great for him. His books were so far ahead of their time and in his day he was categorized into the sci-fi ghetto but time has caught up and I think people now see him for what he was, a great novelist with a lot of really stunning ideas, a lot of depth, passionately wonderful characters and just a great view of the world. Back then what he thought would have been called conspiracy or crackpot thinking. But a lot of it has proved pretty prescient. Thats why this book felt very contemporary to me.
DRE: For the most part your non studio films have a very slow pace. Does it just take a slower pace to tell a more mature story?
RL: I think a lot of it has to do with the story that unfolds via the characters rather than plot driven. If you get caught up too much in a big plot, you tend to have to move faster and have more going on. This story is paced leisurely. But if you just think about it, it does take place over just a few days initially. But it just doesnt have a really hurried pace. All the nice little plot twists and turns are set in a hanging out type atmosphere.
DRE: It almost seems like you could pick up with this group of characters at any time in their lives and do another whole movie about them.
RL: [laughs] That goes for a lot of characters but of course it would be a different movie. To see guys the age of Woody Harrelson, Robert Downey Jr., Rory Cochrane, Winona Ryder, you think that theres been a life previous to this. We see it with Bob Arctors character with his wife and kid with a straight existence. Thats probably true of the other guys too but theyve reconvened in a different familial situation.
DRE: Could this be Rorys character from Dazed and Confused all grown up and on a new drug?
RL: [laughs] He should have stuck with just the marijuana.
DRE: How was it working with Rory again?
RL: Wonderful. The thing about working with actors, you just want to work with them again when the part is right. Ive would love to do it again with so many people in this movie. I was very lucky. Its a wonderful cast.
DRE: For the DVD of A Scanner Darkly will we get to see scenes before they were rotoscoped?
RL: I hope so. I think therell be a number of features like that. It wont show the entire movie in live action but maybe there will be some deleted scenes.
DRE: It is so rare that any director has more than one DVD turned into a Criterion Collection DVD. You have Slacker and Dazed and Confused just came out. How was it working on the Criterion Dazed and Confused?
RL: Criterion is great to work with. I really trust them and I just give it over and what you get back is fantastic. It feels good to have a resting place for your movie, because you cant get any better than Criterion. Its there for the fans. Theres a lot of additional material. After over ten years, it feels like the final resting place.
DRE: Years ago I read that when you were shooting Dazed and Confused you were surprised that Universal Pictures wanted you to shoot out of sequence. But now it seems that youve really settled into doing studio films alongside indie films.
RL: Yeah Im in a pretty good relationship with everybody Im working with. Its important to understand what youre doing at any time. As long as everyone agrees on what the movie is and what it isnt then you wont have problems later on. Ive been very lucky because Ive never had bad creative experiences. You hear these things where they put the movie away and re-shoot endings and everybody hates everybody but Ive never had that experience. Every movie Ive finished is the movie I wanted to make, pure and simple.
DRE: Thats pretty amazing that youve had no bad experiences because youve had some films which havent been loved by critics or audiences.
RL: A lot of it is timing though and who doesnt have that at some point. But its how you react to that. All you can do is bring youre A game every time and do your best but sometimes the culture seems ready to embrace what youre doing and sometimes it doesnt. Overall Ive been lucky so I cant complain.
DRE: Are hamburgers the substitute for Substance D in Fast Food Nation?
RL: [laughs] In a way. In an addicting not very good for you, way.
DRE: Do you feel like theres parallels between Fast Food Nation and A Scanner Darkly?
RL: Not that much really. I think just the fact that theyre coming out near each other begs the question. Fast Food Nation is very much of the real world today. It has things like labor issues so it exists in its own weird world. I personally dont see many similarities. On some levels people can see the social critique elements of both movies but thats not what it is to me.
DRE: Are you writing anything completely original right now?
RL: Ive got a couple things Im working on. I guess this is my era of interesting and challenging adaptations. Im writing a college comedy thing. I dont know when Ill shoot it but it is something that Ive been thinking about for a while.
DRE: Would that be a bigger studio film?
RL: I think it would be good for the studio label.
by Daniel Robert Epstein
SG Username: AndersWolleck
Check out the official website for A Scanner Darkly
Daniel Robert Epstein: Many of the scenes in A Scanner Darkly reminded me of my friends and I sitting around getting high. We would turn to the person we knew the least and go, You know what, youre a narc.
Richard Linklater: [laughs] This book was a little autobiographical for Philip K. Dick because at one point his family moved out and these guys moved in. It was sort of an open door policy. The people he loved were coming by and he was the host of his house. He was witty, smart and he told long stories. There were a lot of people around and he grew suspicious, especially at this time in history, that there were people around who were undercover.
DRE: In the respect of people just randomly coming by and crashing in his house, sounds like it could be autobiographical for you as well.
RL: That was me in the 80s. We all have that point in our lives. We left the front door open so people could just come in any time.
DRE: Was that in your mind when you were making this movie?
RL: It was probably in my mind as I approached the novel as something I could make into a movie. I think before you take something like that on you better feel that it is yours. There were a lot of elements that made me think, This is the Philip K. Dick novel that I could make a movie out of. Theres probably a lot of his books I couldnt, but I felt I knew these people. I knew this worked and I felt that I had a handle on it.
DRE: When you watched a scene in a movie before you guys rotoscoped how did that differ from when you watched a scene once you added the animation?
RL: The scenes without animation seemed very literal. Film is a pretty blunt instrument. This whole story exists in an altered state of being and consciousness. It definitely now has a lack of reality. In my mind, it didnt work near as well live action, there are a lot of elements that would have stood out.
DRE: Is there a future for rotoscoping besides commercials and what you do?
RL: I think people will always try to tell stories in ways that they think work for the story. Its an interesting time for animation. If theres anything going on I think its the home computer animation. Not the Pixar version because thats pretty far out of reach for everybody but more along the lines of indie animation. Adult animation is a marginalized world which is not taken too seriously in the same way that Philip K. Dicks sci-fi writing was maybe not taken too serious. In its day there was a sophisticated type of person who would look down their nose at it. That same person would look at the animation and not see what it is trying to do.
DRE: Philip K. Dicks work seems just as relevant now as it ever did.
RL: Yeah I think so. I think time has been nothing but great for him. His books were so far ahead of their time and in his day he was categorized into the sci-fi ghetto but time has caught up and I think people now see him for what he was, a great novelist with a lot of really stunning ideas, a lot of depth, passionately wonderful characters and just a great view of the world. Back then what he thought would have been called conspiracy or crackpot thinking. But a lot of it has proved pretty prescient. Thats why this book felt very contemporary to me.
DRE: For the most part your non studio films have a very slow pace. Does it just take a slower pace to tell a more mature story?
RL: I think a lot of it has to do with the story that unfolds via the characters rather than plot driven. If you get caught up too much in a big plot, you tend to have to move faster and have more going on. This story is paced leisurely. But if you just think about it, it does take place over just a few days initially. But it just doesnt have a really hurried pace. All the nice little plot twists and turns are set in a hanging out type atmosphere.
DRE: It almost seems like you could pick up with this group of characters at any time in their lives and do another whole movie about them.
RL: [laughs] That goes for a lot of characters but of course it would be a different movie. To see guys the age of Woody Harrelson, Robert Downey Jr., Rory Cochrane, Winona Ryder, you think that theres been a life previous to this. We see it with Bob Arctors character with his wife and kid with a straight existence. Thats probably true of the other guys too but theyve reconvened in a different familial situation.
DRE: Could this be Rorys character from Dazed and Confused all grown up and on a new drug?
RL: [laughs] He should have stuck with just the marijuana.
DRE: How was it working with Rory again?
RL: Wonderful. The thing about working with actors, you just want to work with them again when the part is right. Ive would love to do it again with so many people in this movie. I was very lucky. Its a wonderful cast.
DRE: For the DVD of A Scanner Darkly will we get to see scenes before they were rotoscoped?
RL: I hope so. I think therell be a number of features like that. It wont show the entire movie in live action but maybe there will be some deleted scenes.
DRE: It is so rare that any director has more than one DVD turned into a Criterion Collection DVD. You have Slacker and Dazed and Confused just came out. How was it working on the Criterion Dazed and Confused?
RL: Criterion is great to work with. I really trust them and I just give it over and what you get back is fantastic. It feels good to have a resting place for your movie, because you cant get any better than Criterion. Its there for the fans. Theres a lot of additional material. After over ten years, it feels like the final resting place.
DRE: Years ago I read that when you were shooting Dazed and Confused you were surprised that Universal Pictures wanted you to shoot out of sequence. But now it seems that youve really settled into doing studio films alongside indie films.
RL: Yeah Im in a pretty good relationship with everybody Im working with. Its important to understand what youre doing at any time. As long as everyone agrees on what the movie is and what it isnt then you wont have problems later on. Ive been very lucky because Ive never had bad creative experiences. You hear these things where they put the movie away and re-shoot endings and everybody hates everybody but Ive never had that experience. Every movie Ive finished is the movie I wanted to make, pure and simple.
DRE: Thats pretty amazing that youve had no bad experiences because youve had some films which havent been loved by critics or audiences.
RL: A lot of it is timing though and who doesnt have that at some point. But its how you react to that. All you can do is bring youre A game every time and do your best but sometimes the culture seems ready to embrace what youre doing and sometimes it doesnt. Overall Ive been lucky so I cant complain.
DRE: Are hamburgers the substitute for Substance D in Fast Food Nation?
RL: [laughs] In a way. In an addicting not very good for you, way.
DRE: Do you feel like theres parallels between Fast Food Nation and A Scanner Darkly?
RL: Not that much really. I think just the fact that theyre coming out near each other begs the question. Fast Food Nation is very much of the real world today. It has things like labor issues so it exists in its own weird world. I personally dont see many similarities. On some levels people can see the social critique elements of both movies but thats not what it is to me.
DRE: Are you writing anything completely original right now?
RL: Ive got a couple things Im working on. I guess this is my era of interesting and challenging adaptations. Im writing a college comedy thing. I dont know when Ill shoot it but it is something that Ive been thinking about for a while.
DRE: Would that be a bigger studio film?
RL: I think it would be good for the studio label.
by Daniel Robert Epstein
SG Username: AndersWolleck
VIEW 18 of 18 COMMENTS
garion333:
Great interview, here. Completely relaxed. I'm even more stoked for this damn movie . . . once it is in a theatre near me.
aluminumovercast:
I can hardly wait to see this film, being both a great fan of Phillip K. Dick and the rotoscoping used in A Waking Life. This should be a benchmark for animation, considering the current market. I recently saw Nacho Libre, which was worked on by the Hess brothers and Mike White, who is by far the most underrated writer in film today, and while I know Nacho Libre was sort of a kids' movie, all thirty-seven previews that were shown between Coca-Cola commercials before the film started were for CGI movie with talking animals, or some shit. There has to be a breakthrough soon in commercial film animation, I don't see why rotoscoping can't turn the tide.
