The destruction of General Motors is a heinous concept that threatens the security of this country. It takes a seriously self centered retard to say let the American auto industry(GM) die.

There are two major reasons why GM and the US auto industry is a critical part of the security of this country. First is simply the fact that this country needs manufacturing and the auto industry is almost all thats left of it. During World War II and most wars of this century, GM, Ford and other American automakers made Guns, trucks, parachutes, airplanes, helmets and all sorts of manufactured products. My grandafather who was a WWII vet made no bones about it. The reason we won the war is because this country turned into a manufacturing machine. We could produce tanks and airplanes quicker than the enemy could destroy them. Could we do that today? of course not. If this country went to war with China like they say is inevitable or there is a large Korean war, it's going to shut down everything commercial crossing the Pacific. ALMOST ALL OUR MANUFACURED GOODS COME ACCROSS THE PACIFIC. Now that our manufacturing base is in China, what happens when we go to war with China or Korea??

The other obvious reason we need it is our economy. In recessions and depressions of the past. When people started spending money and bought products such as shoes or clothing or cars it put Americans to work in turn giving other people money to spend. This is now a Walmart economy, it is based on people working at Tacobell spending money at Walmart buying products made in China so that out of every dollar spent, half leaves the country and the other half works on keeping people in near minimum wage jobs and the Waltons rich.

GM has been hurt by a series of thigs they had little control of. Our government failing to do their duties in protecting our manufacturers from unfair trade with countries that have people working for $5 a week. The criminal Gas price roller coaster and the banks running out of money to spend has been crippling to the auto industry. To say let GM die is not just wrong but it is a detriment to this country.

So even if what Congressman Kirk says is true, wouldn't that constitute divulging state secrets? Didn't we just throw a couple in jail for that?

hey midnightblue did you rush out to buy stock in GM?
If investors want nothing to do with a company (because the company is un-profitable, bloated, and produces products that are not wanted etc.) why should all tax payers buy in?

midnightblue69, meet Rush Limbaugh.

In simple terms; because 1 in 10 jobs in this country are tied to the auto industry.

The collapse of GM and the auto industry might be just the kind of creative destruction self educated libertarians require to finally realize that their theories are largely idiotic, narrow minded, and devoid of any comprehensive understanding of economics; but I'm not prepared to see the entire country punished for the educational benefit of a few misguided individuals.

So, just to understand your point. A company that sold the most cars in the world for 77 straight years, only to be overcome last year by 600,000 cars, but still sold 8 million cars in 2008, "produces products that are not wanted?"

That's interesting. Can you explain further?

What fucks me is that YOU KNOW (whooop - whooop - liberal bias alert, liberal bias alert) that if we'd let GM die, the conservatives would be shitting themselves for letting such a good ol' all American-guzzler-producing megacompany bite it. They just want to cry, but they don't realized they're damned either way right now.

Wrecked, you see the problem with you is the problem with too many people. You are watching too much TV, letting other people tell you how to think instead of using your brain for good. You can do it, you really can. Just try.

Here's a little tidbit for you. Last year GM sold more cars, trucks and suv's than anyone else. More than number two Toyota. More than Honda and Nissan put together. They sold more than Nissan, Hundai, VW, BMW, Kia, Mazda, Mercedes, Subaru, Mitsubishi, Suzuki, Jaguar and Isuzu COMBINED.

It seems your little statement about making cars no one wants is not only not true. It's ass backwards.

Another tidbit. Toyota lost more money last quarter than at any time in their 70 year history. Beating out the previous worst quarter, the one before that. Over this year, every auto manufacturer has lost proportional sales from last.

The reason investors didn't want GM stock is beacause the whole world knew that GM was going to be forced into bankruptcy restructuring...not a very wise investment.

As far as why the tax payers should help GM, aside from the reasons I already gave, every year we GIVE 3 billion dollars to Isreal. We GIVE hundreds of billions to build clinics in Africa, to study snails in Ecquador and thousands of unimaginable other things. LOANING money to the largest manufacturer and job producer in this country is not a big deal to me.

You have every right to express your opinion but perhaps you should research what you are talking about a little better first eh?

I think you just beat wrecked to death with real arguements, woah

That dull roar you are hearing is our great national Ponzi scheme collapsing around us. One sign of the times:Auditors
have found thatfor the last decade major auto companies was run with all the strategic vision of a child's lemonade stand. This includes banks insurance companies and our goverment. I wrote my rep's to tell them it would not work as it is simple economics supply and demand, and what the market will bare. Well people the party line is a failure, the cost is beyond what the market will bare. Bankruptcy! Duh! These companies are failing because we can no longer buy the products!!!!

Spending our money that we do not have for bail outs for so called saving jobs, what bullshit. Borrowing from a tax base that are losing jobs because of the failing way of life!

The we get pyshco's that believe throwing dead fish will hurt the fish. The same thing as our leaders, living in a fanacy world!!!!!!!

Obama is trying his best to fix an utter disaster- I sure wouldn't want his job- it can't help when he is still being torpedoed by some members of the GOP- we are all in the same ship, why try and sink it? GM or Chrysler going down would just add to the disaster we are currently in... Why can't this country pull together and work on this mess? It did in WWII against multiple common enemies...
Consorting with China right now should be treason- of course all of the companies that shifted production out of the America's into China should probably be charged with the same...an old economics professor of mine once said "The definition of a 1st world nation is one that imports raw goods, and exports finished product....the definition of a third world nation is one that exports raw goods and imports finished products"
Where does that put the USA right now? Scrap metal prices in this country are essentially driven by the demand for it in asia....hmmm...
This makes the problem with Japan a decade or more again look like nothing- and I felt that was pretty serious...
P.S.- what exactly is a "pyshco"
The other AFF's deserve it, but seem rather tame compared to some of our elected leaders, and their actions that affect the whole country...
Not related to the article-but something I want to vent....the quality of a lot- but not all- of the "Made in China" stuff is so poor- I can't believe anyone willingly buys it- except for when there is no choice
If we as a country boycott anything- what about products made in China- just a suggestion of something that would maybe make sense?

Wait. We, the United States, give HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS to build clinics in Africa? Care to provide a reference?

And why is this country so important relative to other nations? Fuck them right, let's just wave our gargantuan nationalistic flag in their faces and perhaps smother them with it when they step out of line. America, fuck yeah!

I owned a GM product once. It was an absolute piece of crap. GM's point of view was that I bought it, my problem, so sad for me. I have a close friend who came from a 'Ford' family - until she had a similar problem with a brand new Mustang. None of them drive Ford anymore. Oh the wonders of customer service. I guess any fan of the free market doesn't want to see a purchase tangled with patriotism because it just leads to arrogance, poor management, shoddy merchandise, corporate corruption.....It's a pity that Walmart, who championed the movement of manufacturing to China back in the early nineties, has so convinced consumers that buying something for a buck and having to replace it frequently is preferential to paying a reasonable price for something decent - to protect their survival, Walmart played the most significant role in crippling North American manufacturing, but I'm guessing many 'patriot's' shop at that great U.S. institution. The loss of so much manufacturing does have an impact on our self-sufficiency, but I believe advanced economies are now defined as being idea/service based, so I wouldn't write us off entirely.

Oh, another tidbit about Ford [let alone Ford Motor Credit Co.], if you can't afford to BUY a car for 10 grand, but instead finance it, you'll still end up being fucked over, becaues they'll "sell" you the car AT retail price without negotiation. Whether you have shitty credit or not. For instance, I had a 96 ford escort that I couldn't sell or trade whatsoever, it was falling apart and basically a death trap of metal on 4 wheels. My only option? Drive to newport kentucky and trade the piece of shit in for a newer car. I did get 1 grand out of it towards a 2006 Ford Focus SE.
What I didn't realize was, they sold the car to me for 15 grand. I got fucked over.
This model/year of a car these days, are worth about 8 grand, if that.
THEN, when you watch the car advertisements on tv, like say, mazda, or chrysler or whatever car company is advertising, sells their BRAND NEW models for less than 15 grand, I'm talkin bout 2009-2010 brand new.
Something just tells me that somoene , somewhere in the auto industry, a fat fucking CEO is STILL greedy, even with the fact that we're in this fuckhole of a recession that impacted the auto industry, them CEOs are STILL making a fuckload of money.
I just wonder what the fuck they even DO with all the money they make.
[besides the fact they were already caught with blowing huge wads on private jets among other luxurious bullshit. What does that say about America ?
Are/were we really that fucking greedy? Before Bush's retarded ass came along, we were all concerned with "get rich or die trying", but then when alot of americans were/are rich, nothing else mattered.

nullthey'll "sell" you the car AT retail price without negotiation.What I didn't realize was, they sold the car to me for 15 grand. I got fucked over

You can't blame ford for what a dealer did. If you didn't realize how much you paid for a car, you should be looking in the mirror for who to blame

The scenario you painted is a common situation in the auto industry in general. You pay book value or more for a car and one year later all you have paid is interest but the car you paid too much for is now worth 4 grand less. You can't trade it without going ridiculously upside down. Thats not the car manufacturer's fault. Thats stupid spending.

I have seen people I have really felt sorry for. I knew a woman who bought a 99 Subaru outback, well out of warantee. She drove it for a year and the motor popped. She needed a $3500 engine for a car worth $3000, she owed $5500 on. What do you do?