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  • TUESDAY NOVEMBER 4 2008 11:00 AM

Filtering the Truth: Religion - Friend or Foe?

Spirituality is a wonderful thing. I have my reservations about religion though. Although some think it's one in the same, I do not. In fact, I think we'd be better off if we all thought that way. Who's to say whose God is the right one to worship? If you pick the wrong one, are you going to be damned even if you live a good life? And what if your deity tells you to do one thing while another tells someone else that you are misguided? With all the strife in the world and all the conflict it causes, I have to wonder... at what point does religion hinder us?

For the last 10 years of my life, I've been pretty non-religious in my personal life. I have spoken out in subtle ways, putting deliberate lyrics out on my albums Short Bus, Title of Record and The Amalgamut that hinted at the beliefs and questions I have on the topic. Something that has always comforted me, as an American, was that the United States was founded on the ideals of FREEDOM: Freedom of religion and freedom of speech. But the reality is, if we do not adhere to the mainstream ideals of religion, we might not feel free to speak our minds.

When I am talking openly about my thoughts on the subject, some people roll their eyes in disgust, like I'm some kind of an asshole because I don't believe like they do. In times of trouble, I turn to what I consider to be my Higher Power-not a higher BEING but a higher POWER...which is the incredible power of nature. So I understand this need to believe in something greater than oneself. But THEIR religion is not MY answer. What's wrong with that?

Now why is this guy brining up THIS topic on the Suicide Girls site, you may be asking yourself right about now... and the reason is: Bill Maher's Religulous and the movie W. Two great new films, which moved me to speak my mind about religion, its unfortunate place in our government, and how -- depending on your perspective -- it might not be such a good thing for the planet.

Many years ago, peasants were stealing from each other and murderers were running rampant throughout the world. To deal with the mayhem, rulers came to the conclusion that putting the fear of God in the masses would keep them in line. Organized religion started as a way for those in power to get what they needed from the people. It's true to this day. Barack Obama was right on when he said that people on the outskirts of society, in rural areas, cling to their guns and religion. And I think that's a scary thing.

Modern organized religion just seems like a lot of hypocrisy to me. Not one religion can prove that they alone are right. Similarly none are blameless –– I mean, how many deaths have been caused by religion? Can you name one religion where people haven't died in its name?

The 19 hijackers on 9/11 read something in the Koran, declared Jihad and decided that Americans should die. Their religion was the catalyst for them to do something insane. When a right-to-lifer blows up an abortion clinic, they do it in the name of God. Save a life by taking lives? In the name of religion? Hitler killed the Jews (and other people who weren't like him, for that matter), and Christians killed people who were Christian –– but weren't the right kind –– during the Spanish Inquisition. I think religion is clouding everyone's thinking. When George W. Bush started saying, "God has spoken to me," and used this belief as an excuse to go to war with Iraq, many Christians in this country were nodding their heads and saying, "YES!"

If someone I knew said that God told him to pick a fight with someone, I would smack him in the face to snap him out of it. That's the same reason why I wouldn't make big decisions based on the advice of someone who uses an Ouija board or who believes in astrology, because it's dangerous.

I have a religious Christian friend who says the world is 6000 years old, and carbon dating is fake and unreliable –– faked by thousands of scientists and universities all over the world. He chooses to ignore the geological proof of evolution and the fact that this planet is billions of years old, scientifically speaking, because it's so overwhelmingly against the Christian version of the story. This friend of mine says that God created man out of sand in seven days... and this is coming from a 26-year-old man.

Religion blinds to the point of irrationality. It also conveniently dehumanizes. In California, we have a bill on the ballot known as Proposition 8, which deals with whether or not gay people can marry. I get calls daily from different people who have different opinions on the subject. The religious people seem to have a problem with homosexuality –– same-sex people in love –– though Jesus supposedly preached love above all else. Just because some people interpret a book to say that it's wrong for two same-sex people to be in love, our government tries to deny those people's fundamental rights to live peacefully and equally.

And then we have a religious book, the Koran, that says women should be treated like second-class citizens. They should have to cover themselves from head to toe with burkas. They should only be wives and mothers. They can't drive a car. They can't vote. In most Arab countries, they have no voice at all. It's like they don't exist. All in the name of religion. The same religion that inspires the Jihadists to bring down big, bad America.

I mean, what is all of this saying to our youth? I have a daughter. I want her to grow up knowing she can be who she is -- whoever she turns out to be -- and can do whatever she wants to do in life. Can't we put these religious texts in CONTEXT?

At times, I find myself on my knees, begging for something good to happen but wondering whom to beg. I would be really happy if there was a paradise after we die, but I don't think any of us should have to wait. My family, my friends, my planet, this should be our paradise NOW. This ain't the dress rehearsal people. This is the SHOW! We need to stop waiting for the man in the sky to take care of everything, let's do it OURSELVES. Let's do it NOW!


Richard Patrick is the frontman for the rock band Filter. Their latest album, Anthems for the Damned, which features the single "Soldiers of Misfortune," is in stores now. A download-only collection of Anthems tracks re-worked, titled Remixes for the Damned, will be available online from November 4. The band are currently on tour. Click HERE for more info.

 

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bettybruises

bettybruises

USA
August 2008

NOV 05, 2008 06:29 PM

User4574 said:
btw - I'm epileptic - so I just did a little googling ...


81 cases reviewed yielding an incidence of epilepsy after ECT 5 times higher than without. 2/3 patients had more than one seizure.




A 65 year old man who had "successfully" undergone 12 ECT's came in for more. After the sixth caused a seven minute convulsion he was brought for a seventh 3 days later but began convulsing before the ECT could be started. The authors declare their technique to have been impeccably modern and conclude: "To our knowledge this is the first report of a seizure as a complication of modern unilateral ECT."



http://www.idiom.com/~drjohn/ectseize.html

No thank you.



i fortunately outgrew epilepsy by the time I was 8 or 9, and yeah....no thanks.....
WTF?????

User4574

User4574

Redding, CA
September 2008

NOV 05, 2008 06:35 PM

Varuka_Salt said:



Many of those alternative medicines do work.
Perhaps not for the reasons the practitioners think, but they often do work nonetheless.


It's called the placebo effect.



OK - it's really no one's business, but ...
When I was young, I had so many kidney and bladder infections I was on septra all the time (until I became allergic to it - then it was macrodantin or something like that)

When I was 9, the urologist came to the conclusion that the only way to keep me healthy was for me to be on a catheter for the rest of my life.

My fifth grade teacher was engaged to a homeopath. He wasn't just any fly by night homeopath, he was trained in Europe where they still have standards - here in the US, anyone can call themselves a homeopath. But in Europe, they actually have proper schools for it. He also was a Chiropractic Doctor from an accredited US medical school.

He gave me a homeopathic remedy that worked, the kidney reflux stopped, and it stopped permanently.

You can call that placebo if you want - but it didn't happen to you. You weren't scheduled to be taught how to stick a tube up your wang as the only way to pee. I was.

sick

sick

Minneapolis, MN
June 2003

NOV 05, 2008 06:38 PM

infAMY75 said:

User4574 said:
btw - I'm epileptic - so I just did a little googling ...


81 cases reviewed yielding an incidence of epilepsy after ECT 5 times higher than without. 2/3 patients had more than one seizure.




A 65 year old man who had "successfully" undergone 12 ECT's came in for more. After the sixth caused a seven minute convulsion he was brought for a seventh 3 days later but began convulsing before the ECT could be started. The authors declare their technique to have been impeccably modern and conclude: "To our knowledge this is the first report of a seizure as a complication of modern unilateral ECT."



http://www.idiom.com/~drjohn/ectseize.html

No thank you.



i fortunately outgrew epilepsy by the time I was 8 or 9, and yeah....no thanks.....
WTF?????



Please note that the first study quoted is from 1983. The second is from 1992. In other words, there's a possibility that they're horribly outdated.

bettybruises

bettybruises

USA
August 2008

NOV 05, 2008 06:45 PM

Sick said:

infAMY75 said:

User4574 said:
btw - I'm epileptic - so I just did a little googling ...


81 cases reviewed yielding an incidence of epilepsy after ECT 5 times higher than without. 2/3 patients had more than one seizure.




A 65 year old man who had "successfully" undergone 12 ECT's came in for more. After the sixth caused a seven minute convulsion he was brought for a seventh 3 days later but began convulsing before the ECT could be started. The authors declare their technique to have been impeccably modern and conclude: "To our knowledge this is the first report of a seizure as a complication of modern unilateral ECT."



http://www.idiom.com/~drjohn/ectseize.html

No thank you.



i fortunately outgrew epilepsy by the time I was 8 or 9, and yeah....no thanks.....
WTF?????



Please note that the first study quoted is from 1983. The second is from 1992. In other words, there's a possibility that they're horribly outdated.



is 2007 too antiquated for you?
http://www.pr.com/press-release/46497

Twelve

Twelve

Bay City, MI
April 2007

NOV 05, 2008 06:48 PM

User4574 said:
OK - it's really no one's business, but ...
When I was young, I had so many kidney and bladder infections I was on septra all the time (until I became allergic to it - then it was macrodantin or something like that)

When I was 9, the urologist came to the conclusion that the only way to keep me healthy was for me to be on a catheter for the rest of my life.

My fifth grade teacher was engaged to a homeopath. He wasn't just any fly by night homeopath, he was trained in Europe where they still have standards - here in the US, anyone can call themselves a homeopath. But in Europe, they actually have proper schools for it. He also was a Chiropractic Doctor from an accredited US medical school.

He gave me a homeopathic remedy that worked, the kidney reflux stopped, and it stopped permanently.

You can call that placebo if you want - but it didn't happen to you. You weren't scheduled to be taught how to stick a tube up your wang as the only way to pee. I was.



People have also had miraculous recoveries from other diseases despite refusing all treatment. One case is an exception, not the rule.

The difference between these "alternative practitioners" and modern doctors is that the doctors would actually test whatever you were given and find out why it worked.

According to homeopaths, serial dilution, with shaking between each dilution, removes the toxic effects of the substance, while the essential qualities are retained by the diluent (water, sugar, or alcohol).



This is what I found looking up what homeopathic medicine is. It is patently false.

Heigai

Heigai

Columbus, OH
May 2004

NOV 05, 2008 06:49 PM

User4574 said:

Varuka_Salt said:



Many of those alternative medicines do work.
Perhaps not for the reasons the practitioners think, but they often do work nonetheless.


It's called the placebo effect.



OK - it's really no one's business, but ...
When I was young, I had so many kidney and bladder infections I was on septra all the time (until I became allergic to it - then it was macrodantin or something like that)

When I was 9, the urologist came to the conclusion that the only way to keep me healthy was for me to be on a catheter for the rest of my life.

My fifth grade teacher was engaged to a homeopath. He wasn't just any fly by night homeopath, he was trained in Europe where they still have standards - here in the US, anyone can call themselves a homeopath. But in Europe, they actually have proper schools for it. He also was a Chiropractic Doctor from an accredited US medical school.

He gave me a homeopathic remedy that worked, the kidney reflux stopped, and it stopped permanently.

You can call that placebo if you want - but it didn't happen to you. You weren't scheduled to be taught how to stick a tube up your wang as the only way to pee. I was.



So, hang on:

Are we talking about the therapy where water molecules "remember" little bits of something that has been in them? I'm asking a sincere question, since that's the only "homeopathy" I'm aware of, and it's total bunk.

However, much like Pauling and Vitamin C, I would imagine that flushing the system with lots of water could lead to anecdotes like your case.

It is potentially placebo effect; it is definitely anecdotal. No, it didn't happen to us. It happened only to you and is not in any way secondarily observable or repeatable. Regardless of what the homeopath was doing. (Since I refer back to my original question.)

This fits right in with the way dialogue on religious belief can often break down:

"You don't understand--you just feel it." (been there)
"But it cured my sister-in-law!" (just like prayer and psychic surgery)

I guess a shorter way to continue this conversation is to ask you: Do you not have even the slightest bit of doubt that homeopathy cured you on its own merit?

Twelve

Twelve

Bay City, MI
April 2007

NOV 05, 2008 06:51 PM

infAMY75 said:

riiight, but where do you think most medicines come from?
a lot of the qualities found in plants were isolate ddown to produce medicines.

http://www.bayeraspirin.com/pain/asp_history.html

The history of aspirin for example.....

Do your research before making blanket comments and insulting others who don't share your opinions please......



And again the difference is that aspirin has been subjected to scientific scrutiny. We know why it works, and more importantly it's been proven work.

Heigai

Heigai

Columbus, OH
May 2004

NOV 05, 2008 06:52 PM

Twelve said:

According to homeopaths, serial dilution, with shaking between each dilution, removes the toxic effects of the substance, while the essential qualities are retained by the diluent (water, sugar, or alcohol).



This is what I found looking up what homeopathic medicine is. It is patently false.



Yes, this is exactly what I was referring to when I asked earlier.

There is absolutely nothing to show that homeopathy works, and it is barely even logical. If homeopathy's tenets were true, you wouldn't be able to drink any water anywhere because it would all have "imprints" of urine and feces. Forever. It doesn't hold up by the standards of chemistry or physics.

bettybruises

bettybruises

USA
August 2008

NOV 05, 2008 06:59 PM

Twelve said:

infAMY75 said:

riiight, but where do you think most medicines come from?
a lot of the qualities found in plants were isolate ddown to produce medicines.

http://www.bayeraspirin.com/pain/asp_history.html

The history of aspirin for example.....

Do your research before making blanket comments and insulting others who don't share your opinions please......



And again the difference is that aspirin has been subjected to scientific scrutiny. We know why it works, and more importantly it's been proven work.



right but the point is, there was a time it wasn't, that doesn't mean that it wasn't a valid cure for pain beforehand. The point was that there are probably some scientific explanations for why these things work, and while I would never suggest that someone with a serious condition (me for example, being a diabetic) completely walk awau from western medicine, there are some possible benefits with other methods, nutirents and whole foods that people have benefited from. fairly recently chromium was accepted as a supplement that does help regulate blood sugars for diabetics by the medical institution, and it had been given to diabetics by alternative medicine practitioners for years....

so are you saying "it only works once it has been subjected to scientific inquiry"? because that's what it sounds like. The whole point made earlier was some of this stuff does work, and over time has been accepted by western medicine despite their initial resistance...
calling something a placebo simply because it hasn't been accepted by the FDA doesn't make sense....
yeah there's a lot of b.s. cures out there, but you can't just make a blanket statement and say that it's ALL invalid until western medicine says it is.

Varuka_Salt

Varuka_Salt

I'm lost
October 2006

NOV 05, 2008 07:11 PM

infAMY75 said:

Varuka_Salt said:



Many of those alternative medicines do work.
Perhaps not for the reasons the practitioners think, but they often do work nonetheless.


It's called the placebo effect.



riiight, but where do you think most medicines come from?
a lot of the qualities found in plants were isolate ddown to produce medicines.

http://www.bayeraspirin.com/pain/asp_history.html

The history of aspirin for example.....

Do your research before making blanket comments and insulting others who don't share your opinions please......



What the fuck are you talking about?

Twelve

Twelve

Bay City, MI
April 2007

NOV 05, 2008 07:12 PM

infAMY75 said:

SPOILERS! (Click to view)

Twelve said:

infAMY75 said:

riiight, but where do you think most medicines come from?
a lot of the qualities found in plants were isolate ddown to produce medicines.

http://www.bayeraspirin.com/pain/asp_history.html

The history of aspirin for example.....

Do your research before making blanket comments and insulting others who don't share your opinions please......



And again the difference is that aspirin has been subjected to scientific scrutiny. We know why it works, and more importantly it's been proven work.



right but the point is, there was a time it wasn't, that doesn't mean that it wasn't a valid cure for pain beforehand. The point was that there are probably some scientific explanations for why these things work, and while I would never suggest that someone with a serious condition (me for example, being a diabetic) completely walk awau from western medicine, there are some possible benefits with other methods, nutirents and whole foods that people have benefited from. fairly recently chromium was accepted as a supplement that does help regulate blood sugars for diabetics by the medical institution, and it had been given to diabetics by alternative medicine practitioners for years....

so are you saying "it only works once it has been subjected to scientific inquiry"? because that's what it sounds like. The whole point made earlier was some of this stuff does work, and over time has been accepted by western medicine despite their initial resistance...
calling something a placebo simply because it hasn't been accepted by the FDA doesn't make sense....
yeah there's a lot of b.s. cures out there, but you can't just make a blanket statement and say that it's ALL invalid until western medicine says it is.




Not at all. I'm all for trying out new medicines. What I'm saying is that believing things work in the face of scientific evidence to the contrary is foolish at best, and actively harmful at worst.

Without that scrutiny, there is no good reason to believe that it works, and again, this has the potential to be harmful rather than helpful.

roubles

roubles

I'm lost
June 2008

NOV 05, 2008 07:12 PM

Didn't Stalin, Mao and other Communist leaders outlaw religion-the "opiate of the masses?" That really made those countries great places to live!

Varuka_Salt

Varuka_Salt

I'm lost
October 2006

NOV 05, 2008 07:14 PM

roubles said:
Didn't Stalin, Mao and other Communist leaders outlaw religion-the "opiate of the masses?" That really made those countries great places to live!



Who said anything about outlawing religion?

Cassiel

Cassiel

Aurora, CO
September 2004

NOV 05, 2008 07:15 PM

why hasn't rusty_metal_ass posted in this thread yet?

Varuka_Salt

Varuka_Salt

I'm lost
October 2006

NOV 05, 2008 07:17 PM

Cassiel said:
why hasn't rusty_metal_ass posted in this thread yet?



Who says he hasn't?

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