• news
  • FRIDAY AUGUST 8 2008 12:30 PM

Russian and Georgian Forces Clash in Ossetia

Tags: Russia, war

"Russia is fighting a war with us in our own territory," Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili announced today.

Reuters reported today that the Russian military has entered into territory claimed by the Republic of Georgia - what is currently a breakaway region known as South Ossetia. Russian tanks are currently clashing with Georgian forces in South Ossetia and the Russian airforce is striking targets in Georgia proper.

Russia's decision to use force stemmed most immediately from Georgia's attack on the Ossetian capital of Tskhinvali yesterday. Conflict over spy drones, mutual sniper attacks, and artillery shelling has marred Russian-Georgian relations in the preceding weeks and months.

Russia claims that Georgia is to blame for the fighting:

Saakashvili rejected Russian assertions that the fighting was sparked by events in South Ossetia, where Moscow accuses Georgian forces of aggressive action against Russian peacekeepers and others.


Meanwhile, the Georgian president accuses Russian forces of intentionally targeting civilians and dismisses the Russian claims.

For those not familiar with politics of the south Caucasus, Georgia is an independent nation that borders Russia, Turkey, Azerbaijan, and Armenia. The nation is known for its excellent wines (like kindzmarauli and kvanchkara), spicy cuisine, and being the birthplace of Iosif Dzhugashvili - better known as Stalin. The landscape of Georgia is beautiful and it is home to four UNESCO cultural heritage sites. The population of Georgia is overwhelmingly Eastern Orthodox and has been Christian since Roman times. It is also the home to 12 different living languages (plus Russian and Armenian) and at least 18 distinct ethnic groups.

Russian-Georgian relations date back to the early 1860s, when King Herekle asked for Russian aid (as a fellow Orthodox nation) to secure their independence against both the Ottoman Turks and the Qajar Persians who competed for dominance of the Caucasus. Russia, under Catherine the Great, repeatedly failed to honor military obligations to Herekle but due to court intrigue, the aging monarch feared for the survival of his dynasty. Consequently, he signed the Treaty of Georgievsk in 1873, making Russia the protector of the eastern half of modern Georgia. Under Paul I, Russia formally annexed eastern Georgia in 1801 and conquered the rest within 10 years. The nation remained part of the Russian empire and the Soviet Union (with the exception of a brief independence following the collapse of the Romanov dynasty) until 1991, when Georgia declared its independence.

Things were not rosy* for post-independence Georgia, however, as even the former Soviet dissident and human rights activist Zviad Gamsakhurdia ruled in an authoritarian manner (even accusing his enemies of "sabotage" and treason). After his ouster by a violent coup, the opposition forces appointed Eduard Shevardnadze as president of the nation. His rule was likewise characterized by corruption and nepotism, leading to his peaceful ouster in the Rose Revolution of 2003. Russian Foreign Minister Ivanov negotiated the resignation of Gamsakhurdia in a summit meeting with the Georgian president and the opposition (including pro-Western and American-educated current president Mikheil Saakashvili).

While political representation has taken a turn for the better in the past five years in Georgia, the country is plagued with problems. Almost half of the population lives beneath the poverty line. Corruption and crime are rampant. More importantly - two regions of Georgia broke away after the 1991 independence: South Ossetia and Abkhazia. Following Saakashvili's campaign promises to clamp down on separatism, the leader of the autonomous region of Adjara also threatened to secede, leading to another crisis. While Georgia resolved the Adjara crisis peacefully, it was defeated militarily in its campaigns in both South Ossetia and Abkhazia. Georgia cannot exert military control over either region, largely due to Russian support of the separatists. Both of these conflicts led to slaughter of innocent civilians by all sides and ended in ethnic cleansing of the Georgian population in the breakaway regions.

South Ossetia continues to be a problem for Russian-Georgian relations. The UN, EU, and NATO refuse to recognize South Ossetia as an independent nation, while Russia extends visas to the population. Georgia hopes to suppress the Ossetian de facto independence and Saakashvili is under pressure from the public to do so. Meanwhile, Russia backs South Ossetia as a means of exerting power over Georgia and countering American influence in the region.

America, in fact, is deeply involved in the Russian-Georgian conflict at least in the eyes of the two players. Following George W. Bush's visit to Tbilisi in 2005, the Georgians renamed the street by their airport to "George W. Bush avenue." As a Reuters article notes, the United States has 120 soldiers in Georgia. President Saakashvili asserts that the influence of the US is even deeper, though. According to him, the latest Russian-Georgian conflict:

... is not about Georgia anymore. It's about America, its values.


He continued to say:

They made no secret. The are unhappy with our closeness with the United States, with the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, with the West in general.


Meanwhile, the NY Times reports that:

Georgia is also valuable to Washington because it is an ally in the Iraq war. With 2,000 troops in Iraq, it is the third-largest contributor of troops there, after the United States and Britain.


The United States will have difficulty remaining uninvolved, especially given Georgia's immediate decision to pull these troops out of Iraq.

US Presidential candidate John McCain has called on Russia to withdraw from Georgia and asks for an emergency UN Security Council meeting (Note: one already took place 12 hours before he called for it). Some bloggers are already claiming that this event will increase McCain's rating in polls because of his hawkish stance.

*Yeah, that's a pun on Georgia's Rose Revolution...

 

Previous

PAGE: 

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6

 ... 8

Next

Comments
Weatherpunk

Weatherpunk

Japan
June 2008

AUG 09, 2008 01:15 PM

As of 8PM GMT, CNN is reporting that Georgia has declared a "state of war" which is just short of declaring outright war with Russia. Apparently, Russia has escalated the conflict, according to Georgian media.

CNN elaborated a bit on what a "state of war" meant in terms of the president's authority over there. It seems to be similar to America's "state of emergency" and is just below declaring martial law.

I'm starting to see this clearly as Russian aggression, as the president of Georgia has repeatedly called for an immediate cease-fire and the Russian attacks have only gotten worse. I'm keeping my eyes on the news for updates to this in between the crap-stories that have received more coverage. Stupid John Edwards affair.....

SergeantPsycho

SergeantPsycho

USA
January 2007

AUG 09, 2008 02:31 PM

The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.

SockPuppet

SockPuppet

I'm lost
July 2006

AUG 09, 2008 03:30 PM

SergeantPsycho said:
The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.



Given that this is probably about Georgia's application to join NATO, that's exactly the wrong thing to do.

SergeantPsycho

SergeantPsycho

USA
January 2007

AUG 09, 2008 05:10 PM

SockPuppet said:

SergeantPsycho said:
The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.



Given that this is probably about Georgia's application to join NATO, that's exactly the wrong thing to do.



Doubtful. I'd say it's more probably about only the pipeline to Europe that doesn't run through Russia. In that case, it's probably exactly the right thing to do.

wildswan

wildswan

I'm lost
June 2006

AUG 09, 2008 05:27 PM

SergeantPsycho said:

Doubtful. I'd say it's more probably about only the pipeline to Europe that doesn't run through Russia. In that case, it's probably exactly the right thing to do.



Anyone have a decoder ring?

SergeantPsycho said:
The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.



You are quite clearly not a military strategist.

SockPuppet

SockPuppet

I'm lost
July 2006

AUG 09, 2008 05:29 PM

wildswan said:

SergeantPsycho said:
The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.



You are quite clearly not a military strategist.



I can only hope so.

wildswan

wildswan

I'm lost
June 2006

AUG 09, 2008 05:53 PM

SockPuppet said:

wildswan said:

SergeantPsycho said:
The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.



You are quite clearly not a military strategist.



I can only hope so.



I'm not a military strategist either, but I'm fairly certain that Georgia couldn't accomplish anything but a disaster with a proposition like that. Saakashvili is in a hard place: he's withdrawing the thousand troops he has from Iraq, to what end (as far as the conflict with Russia goes)?

I believe that he hopes to get the US to put great amounts of pressure on Russia through the Security Council; are we well positioned to do that? I certainly don't know.

crispy

crispy

NEWSWIRE

Philadelphia, PA

AUG 09, 2008 05:56 PM

wildswan said:

SergeantPsycho said:
The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.


You are quite clearly not a military strategist.


Hey ... they don't make just anyone a sergeant, you know.
So, he's got that going for him.

SockPuppet

SockPuppet

I'm lost
July 2006

AUG 09, 2008 05:58 PM

wildswan said:

SockPuppet said:

wildswan said:

SergeantPsycho said:
The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.



You are quite clearly not a military strategist.



I can only hope so.



I'm not a military strategist either, but I'm fairly certain that Georgia couldn't accomplish anything but a disaster with a proposition like that. Saakashvili is in a hard place: he's withdrawing the thousand troops he has from Iraq, to what end (as far as the conflict with Russia goes)?

I believe that he hopes to get the US to put great amounts of pressure on Russia through the Security Council; are we well positioned to do that? I certainly don't know.



I'm sure they will try. But since part of Russia's problem is that Georgia wants to join NATO, I doubt it will make any difference. frown

SergeantPsycho

SergeantPsycho

USA
January 2007

AUG 09, 2008 07:35 PM

crispy said:

wildswan said:

SergeantPsycho said:
The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.


You are quite clearly not a military strategist.


Hey ... they don't make just anyone a sergeant, you know.
So, he's got that going for him.



The Sergeant part is just a screen name. I'm not currently nor have I ever been, a member of the Military, Police, or Fire Fighting services. Now, as me being a military strategist, I seem to recall a long drawn out argument contradicting FTR's assert that Al-Sadr had won over the Iraqi goverment. So, where's Al-Sadr now? Oh yeah, he's still in Iran. But let's focus on the present shall we? In my estimation, Russia is using this whole South Osseta thing as a pre-text for taking over the BTC Gas pipeline. It's no secret that Russia loves meddling in the affairs of it's neighbors (anyone here with a memory that last longer than the latest news cycle will remember the poisoning of Victory Yushenko during the Ukranian elections in September 2004), and they've also resorted to fuel embargos of some of the other Eastern European countries. So yeah, I think Russia invading Georgia and getting it's shit ruined would help the situation a lot.

TheFuckOffKid

TheFuckOffKid

NEWSWIRE

Australia

AUG 09, 2008 07:40 PM

SergeantPsycho said:

crispy said:

wildswan said:

SergeantPsycho said:
The Russians have sold a lot of weapons to Iran, and I read somewhere they were helping out Iraq before we invaded. Perhaps we should show them that turn about is fair play, and loan the Georgians the use of our A-10s.


You are quite clearly not a military strategist.


Hey ... they don't make just anyone a sergeant, you know.
So, he's got that going for him.



The Sergeant part is just a screen name..



I'm so glad you've informed us of this, lest we all continued believing you were actually a serviceman.

SPOILERS! (Click to view)
Did you REALLY think that wasn't already entirely obvious?

motorfirebox

motorfirebox

Pittsburgh, PA
March 2004

AUG 09, 2008 07:41 PM

crispy said:
Hey ... they don't make just anyone a sergeant, you know.


you'd be surprised.

bean

bean

STAFF

Los Angeles, CA

AUG 09, 2008 08:42 PM

SergeantPsycho said:
In my estimation, Russia is using this whole South Osseta thing as a pre-text for taking over the BTC Gas pipeline. It's no secret that Russia loves meddling in the affairs of it's neighbors (anyone here with a memory that last longer than the latest news cycle will remember the poisoning of Victory Yushenko during the Ukranian elections in September 2004), and they've also resorted to fuel embargos of some of the other Eastern European countries


You know, I was going to post something a lot like this earlier today before I got sidetracked. I don't think it's entirely about the BTC pipeline, but I think everything leading up to the conflict (including Georgia's interest in joining NATO) is tied to the pipeline.

I think this is the first time I've ever heard you make some observation about a world political, economic, or military matter that wasn't mired in mistakes, misjudgments, idiotic statements, or logical fallacies, but then you had to go and say:.

So yeah, I think Russia invading Georgia and getting it's shit ruined would help the situation a lot.

...to which I can only respond: surreal

_kungfoo_

_kungfoo_

Los Angeles, CA
April 2005

AUG 09, 2008 09:43 PM

motorfirebox said:

crispy said:
Hey ... they don't make just anyone a sergeant, you know.


you'd be surprised.



Quoted for truth.

BlastProcessing

BlastProcessing

USA
OLD SKOOL

AUG 09, 2008 10:24 PM

motorfirebox said:

crispy said:
Hey ... they don't make just anyone a sergeant, you know.


you'd be surprised.



They sure as hell didn't make him one.

Previous

PAGE: 

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6

 ... 8

Next