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Louis, by the grace of God, King of France and Navarre, to all present and to come, greeting from the year 1708:

Elves and Ringwraiths, Hobbits and Orcs, Gandalf and Saruman, Aragorn and Sauron, Peace and War, Light and Darkness, White and Black - that's the world of The Lord of the Rings, written more than two centuries after my death. Nevertheless, I read it last week - as what you call an eBook. Downloading such a huge oeuvre into the 18th century with a steam-powered computer is a pain in the ass - but it was worth it.

Personally, I love this book. It's very creative and rich, one of the best stories I've ever read. It's basically kind of a huge fairytale (or "literary legend" if you prefer this expression).

But that's the point: It's a fairytale. In a fairytale, it's natural to have "Good" fighting against "Evil". In a fairytale, Good and Evil are not question of behaviour, not a question of ethics, but a question of nature. Elves are good by nature, Orcs are evil by nature. Gandalf and Aragorn are good by nature, Sauron and the Nazgūl are evil by nature. As in this kind of story, good guys naturally ally with other good guys against evil guys, good and evil become also a question of sides:

Good = Us, Evil = Them

The good guys are good because they kill the evil guys, and the evil guys are evil because they kill the good guys. A very simple and clear principle. This is how fairytales work.

But what about reality? Can this conception of "Good" and "Evil" be transferred into real life? Would Gandalf be "good" in a world where goodness is - or should be - measured by ethics? Maybe not. He manipulates people. He is friends with fanatic racist Aragorn who kills orcs just for being orcs. He tortures Gollum to retrieve information. He abandons his "friends" always when they need him most. He may be even a liar. (Mister Gandalf, if you were really held prisoner on the top of Isengard, how did you get your wand back?) And power-hungry as he is, he goes far beyond his orders to "help and assist" and becomes the leader of the alliance against Sauron. (Gandalf - ripped out of the fairytale context - makes me believe that there is only one thing worse than a fanatic who pretends being sent by the gods : a fanatic who really is.)

In fact, Gandalf reminds me a real-world person who also wears a beard, a dress, and a funny hat, who feels also he has been send by some divinity, who also is full of hatred on what he considers the "Empire of Evil", and who also sends naļve innocents on suicide missions to destroy what's most precious to his enemies :



As said, this is only under the hypothesis that Gandalf would be torn out of the "fairytale" context. As character in The Lord of the Rings, I like and admire Gandalf.

But I'm digressing. The point is, you can't transfer the "Good vs. Evil" schema from The Lord of the Rings to reality. In reality, "Good" is not a question of what flag you are fighting under, it's a question of ethics, of behaviour. If you define "Good = Us, Evil = Them", you are applying exactly the same logic as Al-Qaeda.

When you run over some creature with a green face in Middle Earth, you can assume that it is evil, and kill it the most cruel way that comes to your mind; it will be okay. But you can't do the same in reality. Here's a photo of a real person with a green face:



His name is Omar Khadr, he is 15. His face is green because he just got shot into the back by a US soldier, twice. He is more or less what you call a "child soldier", and his only sin was that he maybe did what soldiers are supposed to do: kill enemy soldiers. The shooting left him blind in one eye. And as he lies there, his life is just about to become worse: he will be sent to Guantanamo, and, among other humiliations, be used as a human mop to clean urine on the floor..

Jesus said: "What you did to the least of my brothers, you have done to me." (Matthew 25:40) Think about it. I'm pretty sure that when it comes to the Last Judgment, having used Jesus as human mop will not speak in favour of the jailors of Guantanamo.

That's not how I treat my prisoners of war, and I would have executed every officer of mine who treated prisoners this way. Don't these jailors have any honour? Why do they treat their prisoners like human scum, even children? The answer why they do so is, maybe, in one of the first responses to the article I mentioned:

elslowhand said:
. . . These are the bad guys, we are not.



Frightening. That's exactly the attitude that led me to the writing of this article. We are not in LotR - this is reality. And in reality, "good" and "bad" are not questions of sides, but of ethics. And using a prisoner of war as a human mop to clean urine on the floor is not what I call an ethical behaviour.

(Oh, and by the way: Renaming "prisoners of war" into "enemy combatants" to avoid written or unwritten conventions about the treatment of prisoners of war does not help anything.)

Don't misunderstand me: I'm not telling you to turn your swords into ploughshares. I'm not telling you to make peace, not war. Wars have ever existed and will ever exist. I'm currently making war against Austrian Habsbourg and their allies.

But please, please, stop claiming that you are fighting because you are the good guys and they are the bad guys. They are your enemies, but they are not evil for being your enemies. I have probably made more wars than most of you, and I can tell you this: since the dawn of mankind, no war has ever been made for ethics. Wars are made for politics, ideology, territory and such. There is no such thing as a "good vs. evil" war.

Pardon? You don't agree? The War of Secession, to free the poor slaves? Nonsense. This war will be fought to save the Union, not to free the slaves.

Abraham Lincoln will write in 1862:

My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union.


That's what was (will be) behind this war - everything else is war propaganda. In fact, every time someone tells you that you are the good guys and that he wants you to fight the evil guys, you can be pretty sure that it's war propaganda. Bin Laden tells the same thing to his people.

I feel that you still don't agree. I feel that you will object that I'm not well informed down here in 1708, that in your time, at least one intervention of America was a "Good vs. Evil" fight: The intervention in WW2, as it stopped a genocide. I agree that it did stop the genocide - but this was not the reason, it was a side-effect. America didn't intervene because Hitler was slaughtering the Jews - it intervened because he was taking over Europe. If the Allies would have wanted to stop the genocide, they would have bombarded the railroad to Auschwitz with their flying machines, but they didn't. So, stopping the "Evil" was not a priority. Stopping the growth of a rival superpower in Europe was. It wasn't about ethics, it was about politics. As always.

You see, I'm not that uninformed. I might live in 1708, but I've got Internet. However, with a terrible bandwidth.

That's why I think that the meaning of the words "Good" and "Evil" in The Lord of the Rings are not the same as in reality. And that's why I think you should not read this book unless you do realize this difference. This is a wonderful book, but dangerous if read by the simple minds. You are not Elrond, people, I'm not King Aragorn, and Omar Khadr is not an orc. We are all humans who have to question every step we do, and we will once be judged by what we did, not by what flag we were fighting for.

Elves and Ringwraiths, Hobbits and Orcs, Gandalf and Saruman, Aragorn and Sauron, Peace and War, Light and Darkness, White and Black, America and Al-Qaeda, GIs and Terrorists, Christendom and Islam, Good and Evil - do you really think it is so simple?

Given at Versailles in the month of May, in the year of grace 1708, and of our reign the sixty sixth.

 

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DrStinkypants

DrStinkypants

Saint Paul, MN
October 2002

MAY 05, 2008 04:28 PM

Shalome said:

DrStinkypants said:
I'm responding because I generally enjoy what you write, Loiue but I think you're slightly misguided with this one.
I don't think that you can argue that there are no "good guys" and "bad guys" while at the same time arguing that

in reality, "good" and "bad" are not questions of sides, but of ethics".



If ethics are the determining factor in what is good and what is bad, isn't Al-qaeda bad? Isn't an ideology that embraces and exemplifies racism, misogyny, violence, religious oppression, ignorance, and the killing of innocent civilians unethical, and therefore bad?



From their point of view, we kill their civilians, are racist against them, oppress their people with our foreign policy, disrespect their customs, their people, and their land and attempt to destroy their religion, and are ignorant of their beliefs. From their point of view, their beliefs and way of life are ordained by God, and our beliefs and way of life are completely immoral and even morally offensive, a terrible ideology that must be stopped before it spreads.

See how this works?


NOTE: IN CASE YOU ARE A FUCKING IDIOT OR A TROLL, I am not making excuses for nor do I support Al Qaeda. I'm presenting an example; not a defense.



Yea we are getting into semantics here, which I figured would happen. I'm just glad you weren't a huge asshole about it smile

I don't think that the ideologies are a matter of perspective. Our ldeology is that we want to create a stable, democratic, western government, Al-qaeda's ideology is that they want to wipe off the face of the earth anyone who does not yeild to their sharia. I think from any perspective, objectively one of those is more ethical than the other. Now the reality of those ideologies is a different issue

Our actions, and the interpretations of those actions, ARE a matter of perspective though, which I think is what you're talking about. And that being the case, I certainly wouldn't blame anyone who saw the US, as you said, as an imposing, racist, ignorant etc force in a foreign land, but I would certainly disagree with them because I think that at the very least, our intentions are good.

Louis_XIV

Louis_XIV

France
August 2007

MAY 05, 2008 04:40 PM

DrStinkypants said:
I don't think that the ideologies are a matter of perspective.



But they are, because an ideology is a perspective. That's exactly the point.

When two cultures with different value systems clash together, every side will have the impression that the other side has "bad" values and the own side has "good" values. Why? Simply because each side applies its own values to judge both sides' values - which leads, of course, to the result that the own values are "good" and the other side's values are "bad". Hence each side has the impression that the other side has an "evil ideology".

I'll give you an example: When I first connected to the 21th century, I had almost the impression of connecting to the Empire of the Antichrist : Atheism and blasphemy everywhere, unhonorful warfare with terrible doomsday weapons, no respect for souvereigns, political systems that appeared like anarchism to me... (I changed my opinion meanwhile.) On the other side, my time may appear "evil" when measured with the values of your time: Racism, religious oppression, intolerance, despotism... I looked at your time and asked myself "Where is the honor?", and your time looks at my time and wonders "Where are the human rights?" Measured with your own values, your own values will always appear as the best possible values.

See how it works?

SockPuppet

SockPuppet

I'm lost
July 2006

MAY 05, 2008 04:57 PM

DrStinkypants said:

Shalome said:

DrStinkypants said:
I'm responding because I generally enjoy what you write, Loiue but I think you're slightly misguided with this one.
I don't think that you can argue that there are no "good guys" and "bad guys" while at the same time arguing that

in reality, "good" and "bad" are not questions of sides, but of ethics".



If ethics are the determining factor in what is good and what is bad, isn't Al-qaeda bad? Isn't an ideology that embraces and exemplifies racism, misogyny, violence, religious oppression, ignorance, and the killing of innocent civilians unethical, and therefore bad?



From their point of view, we kill their civilians, are racist against them, oppress their people with our foreign policy, disrespect their customs, their people, and their land and attempt to destroy their religion, and are ignorant of their beliefs. From their point of view, their beliefs and way of life are ordained by God, and our beliefs and way of life are completely immoral and even morally offensive, a terrible ideology that must be stopped before it spreads.

See how this works?


NOTE: IN CASE YOU ARE A FUCKING IDIOT OR A TROLL, I am not making excuses for nor do I support Al Qaeda. I'm presenting an example; not a defense.



Yea we are getting into semantics here, which I figured would happen. I'm just glad you weren't a huge asshole about it smile

I don't think that the ideologies are a matter of perspective. Our ldeology is that we want to create a stable, democratic, western government, Al-qaeda's ideology is that they want to wipe off the face of the earth anyone who does not yeild to their sharia. I think from any perspective, objectively one of those is more ethical than the other. Now the reality of those ideologies is a different issue

Our actions, and the interpretations of those actions, ARE a matter of perspective though, which I think is what you're talking about. And that being the case, I certainly wouldn't blame anyone who saw the US, as you said, as an imposing, racist, ignorant etc force in a foreign land, but I would certainly disagree with them because I think that at the very least, our intentions are good.



Good intentions make no difference to those on the receiving end. I do agree that having good intentions helps. But it isn't enough. (Especially if it's just a blind; and the rest of the world could be forgiven for thinking it might be, given it's propagated by those on top of the heap).

joker_

joker_

Windsor, CA
October 2005

MAY 05, 2008 05:11 PM

This was a fantastic article.
Thank you.

J24U

J24U

Danvers, MA
February 2006

MAY 05, 2008 05:19 PM

A+ work Lou

ericwine

ericwine

Charlotte Hall, MD
January 2007

MAY 05, 2008 05:27 PM

Excellent writing, and food for thought, mon Roi.

Ferretbite

Ferretbite

Mexico
September 2006

MAY 05, 2008 06:05 PM

Shiny_Metal_Ass said:
Hire this person immediately.



You don't hire a King, you just do as he says and never argue His word even if you think His vision on why Aragorn killed them orcs may not be correct.

Because arguing with Him gets you deep dans la merde.

Cosmo

Cosmo

Lansdale, PA
November 2003

MAY 05, 2008 06:18 PM

You, sir, never cease to amaze me.

SockPuppet

SockPuppet

I'm lost
July 2006

MAY 05, 2008 06:21 PM

Ferretbite said:

Shiny_Metal_Ass said:
Hire this person immediately.



You don't hire a King, you just do as he says and never argue His word even if you think His vision on why Aragorn killed them orcs may not be correct.

Because arguing with Him gets you deep dans la merde.



You commented in this thread.

Was that wise?

You really haven't got the poiint.

Bill_the_Cat

Bill_the_Cat

West Vancouver, BC
May 2005

MAY 05, 2008 06:22 PM

DrStinkypants said:

Shalome said:

DrStinkypants said:
I'm responding because I generally enjoy what you write, Loiue but I think you're slightly misguided with this one.
I don't think that you can argue that there are no "good guys" and "bad guys" while at the same time arguing that

in reality, "good" and "bad" are not questions of sides, but of ethics".



If ethics are the determining factor in what is good and what is bad, isn't Al-qaeda bad? Isn't an ideology that embraces and exemplifies racism, misogyny, violence, religious oppression, ignorance, and the killing of innocent civilians unethical, and therefore bad?



From their point of view, we kill their civilians, are racist against them, oppress their people with our foreign policy, disrespect their customs, their people, and their land and attempt to destroy their religion, and are ignorant of their beliefs. From their point of view, their beliefs and way of life are ordained by God, and our beliefs and way of life are completely immoral and even morally offensive, a terrible ideology that must be stopped before it spreads.

See how this works?


NOTE: IN CASE YOU ARE A FUCKING IDIOT OR A TROLL, I am not making excuses for nor do I support Al Qaeda. I'm presenting an example; not a defense.



Yea we are getting into semantics here, which I figured would happen. I'm just glad you weren't a huge asshole about it smile

I don't think that the ideologies are a matter of perspective. Our ldeology is that we want to create a stable, democratic, western government, Al-qaeda's ideology is that they want to wipe off the face of the earth anyone who does not yeild to their sharia. I think from any perspective, objectively one of those is more ethical than the other. Now the reality of those ideologies is a different issue

Our actions, and the interpretations of those actions, ARE a matter of perspective though, which I think is what you're talking about. And that being the case, I certainly wouldn't blame anyone who saw the US, as you said, as an imposing, racist, ignorant etc force in a foreign land, but I would certainly disagree with them because I think that at the very least, our intentions are good.



Do you then believe that islamic extremists think their intentions are evil?

MadViking

MadViking

USA
February 2008

MAY 05, 2008 06:55 PM

This may well be the finest writing on the nature of war I have ever read since Machiavelli or Lin Yutang. We claim to live in a civilized world but it is still ruled by our primative tribal instincts. Us=Good/Them=Bad times the square root of Power/Right.

Weso

Weso

Santa Cruz, CA
July 2002

MAY 05, 2008 07:04 PM

You honor us with a very well written piece, good King.

Mylf

Mylf

Framingham, MA
April 2003

MAY 05, 2008 07:27 PM

Fantastic article, your Majesty.

Long live the king.

Volkov

Volkov

Austin, TX
OLD SKOOL

MAY 05, 2008 07:31 PM

Well written article.
I thought the Gandalf/Osama construction was a bit clunky and distracting, but the gist of the piece was clear enough.

Seeing your enemy as an inhuman or subhuman evil creature is certainly a dangerous and contemptible mindset. It's also been in evidence forever in most conflicts. It's especially been present in America's history in a racist sense. You can look at WWII war posters and how they depicted the Japanese. This sort of thinking has NO place in a modern professional military.

HOWEVER. I do think moral relativism can be taken to a point where perspective is lost. As disgusting as those racist WWII posters were, the Japanese were committing atrocities all across China, the Phillipines, and SE Asia. Perhaps the culture or the people as a whole were not "evil", but the actions taken by their military certainly were.

in any case, thinking of your enemy as evil might make it easier to justify your conflict against them in your mind, but it doesn't justify it on the world stage.

the crazy thing is, is that the conflict in Iraq was begun without any real consideration for the fight against Islamic Extremism. If that had been the overriding motivation, we'd still be heavily invested in Afghanistan instead.


also interesting that this article comes on the anniversary [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Blenheim]of one of Louis XIV's worst defeats
one in where the criticisms against the French included


"The French lost this battle for a wide variety of reasons. For one thing they had too good an opinion of their own ability ... Another point was their faulty field dispositions, and in addition there was rampant indiscipline and inexperience displayed ... It took all these faults to lose so celebrated a battle.


and the result was to extend the war which eventually resulted largely in maintaining the status quo.

jerawyn

jerawyn

Costa Mesa, CA
December 2003

MAY 05, 2008 07:40 PM

There were video of executions of people. Those people were just as innocent in my mind as the 15 year old child who is the product of his environment and takes up arms for his beliefs. I can say they are equally as awful and heartbreaking.

There is no right or wrong. There is cruelty and kindness and a desperate shortage of understanding. Tell me the difference in level of cruelty, for i have not found one. It's like finding the depth of another's sadness, when all you really know is your own.

Maybe if we search the depth of our own cruelty, we can come to some general conclusion as to the consensus of right and wrong, but i honestly don't think there is one. And there are too few who really want to explore such dark places in their own souls...which is why i suppose we (we as a society) have standing armies to fight for us and such, and men who command them, and people to blame. So we can all feel lightened and free enough to discuss all the details, like we could ever know the full weight of a decision which took less than a second, in a turmoil we cannot actually fathom.

But aside from all that, I find you as a King and personality, quite enchanting.

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