My personal take is that its ridiculous to take this stance as somehow being against the grain when you are on a major label, playing in arenas with corporate sponsorship and over-inflated ticket prices,.

Many bands bust their ass and help promote small record labels, play and support small music venues, and generally don't overcharge their fans. A great example of this would be Defiance, Ohio, whom sells cd's at very cheap prices, play shows at small local venues (I saw them recently in fact playing at a house of all things) and helping out and assisting other bands and artists with projects. The isnpiration and direct assistance that small diy punk bands like defiance, ohio provide is infinetly more valuable and noteowrthy than the message spread through the million selling Green Day albums.

One could also argue that saying "Fuck George Bush" in a huge arena full of people in Dallas, Texas takes a lot more balls and is a lot more punk rock than saying "Fuck George Bush" in some dude's basement in Madison Wisconsin in front of 30 people.

And I don't think Green Day has ever tried to put themselves out as anti-mainstream or "against the grain". By contrast, they're using their mainstream status to promote progressive political viewpoints and encouraging kids to get involved in the governmental process. I personally find that laudable and wish more artists would have the guts to take a political stand or at the very least actively encourage participation in the process. In addition, anyone who knows Green Day knows that they have always been extremely active in providing very direct assistance to the local and global punk scene, by developing artists themselves and by bringing up-and-coming bands on the road with them and in literally dozens of other ways.

Trying waaaaaay too hard, was my reaction.

i don't know what the big deal is, green day has always sucked. For some reason I was never drawn to the whiny rich kid fake british accent thing. and if I want stuck in your head 3 chord sing alongs, I'd much rather hear the misfits or...well anything

Would I get sued if I made shirts that said "Howard Zinn Molests Children"?

SPOILERS! (Click to view)

Answer: Yes, if accompanied with this photo:

has greenday like broken into everybodies house and kidnapped their puppies or something?

i mean i wouldnt say that i like them much, but i have never seen so many people HATE something/someone with such passion when the object of hate had not offended them in some way. they play their music, some people listen, some dont. so why do the ones that dont listen, so violently loathe the ones that do? what difference does it really make to you?

Oh, let's just face it. We've become the generation that thinks the one below us is dumber.

Kinda like how the generation before us looks at us. And the generation before them look at them... and the generation before that...

Yes, but no one will ever get the message except for the few "special" fans that form themselves around the band. It's like the difference between a local motivational speaker and Martin Luther King. You can change a couple lives on the small level, sure -- and that's all good and well -- but you can't change the world that way.

What I can't understand is that kids that I know who got into punk rock using Green Day as a laucnhing point into Stiff Little Fingers, The Ramones, The Clash, Husker Du, Operation Ivy, etc. etc., now talk about how Green Day was always shitty. It's mostly odd because I remember singing along to "Longview" with these kids -- the difference being that I still appreciate the song, and still appreciate their succinct, melodic and well thought-out songwriting, whereas they've somehow bitten into the "major label=pure unadulterated evil" bullshit. (don't get me wrong, most major labels ARE pure unadulterated evil... but the deals for artists have been tending to get better, because bands are finally going "you know, they want us to make money for them, so let's work out something a bit more equal for all of us.")

Of course, I'm also the crazy person on this site that happens to enjoy what seem to be the most hated bands ever. So maybe I'm wrong.

I do wonder how many people who go to Warped Tour know how Green Day stuck with it, even through the lean periods.

So, yeah, this whole rant is basically wrapped up in this:

Re: Subrosa: Ditto.

preach.

un a moderately-related note, this is the exact reason I'm so excited for Anti-Flag's newest record being released by a major.

I stopped liking Green Day when the music stopped being fun.

I did really like them once upon a time. I spent the summer of 1994, after I first got my driver's license right after my 15th birthday, crusing around Idaho Falls in my parents' car and singing along to Green Day tapes all afternoon.

My snap reaction in recent years, though, has been to hate them altogether because they aren't what I used to like. They've changed into something that, at best, doesn't interest me at all. While it would be silly to discount the albums I did like simply because I don't like their new stuff, I do understand the impulse to just toss it all away in disgust. It's easy to judge the old stuff based on the perception you have of a band today and forget how much you used to like it.

yeah, but you're also entranced by shiny coins and pretty rocks.

thanks for reading and participating, to you and everyone else. i like it when these little blurbs are used as an opportunity to debate shit or express opinions.

i think this is a good thing, and should be encouraged. a little ball busting can keep you honest. just make sure you can take it as well as dish it out.

you know, as someone who is maybe six months away from officially being considered elderly, i've been hearing people play the "what is punk" game for a long, long time -- longer than some of you have been alive. shit, i spent more than a few years playing it myself. but i'm at the point now where, personally, i just don't give a shit -- anyone with even moderate skills at playing devil's advocate could make a half-convincing case that anything -- ANYTHING -- is or isn't punk.

for me, "what is shitty" is a more interesting game to play. and on a superficial level, i'm no fan of green day's music, and have been whining to my friends about having to hear their shitty records since long before they were a household name. however, this:

...is just undeniable, because i've seen it with my own eyes. so while i'd rather listen to coagulating earwax than a green day record myself, my overall personal take on them (like anyone cares) is emphatically "not shitty." bonner's coffee-machine incident aside.

[Edited on Apr 03, 2006 4:25AM]

I'm a legal adult and I don't understand who the man is. Seriously. Pushing rebellion on small children is great, really, but has anyone figured out how we get back to rebelling yet? And who are we rebelling against? Anyone? Who's the man? Am I the man? Is my boss? Is it just Republicans, or any politican? Is it my dad? Leave my dad out of this, you weird fuckers. Someone explain to me, please, who the man is. Sure we could all just collectivly agree it's Rupert Murdoch and McDonalds and Microsoft, but once we're done assasigning them spikes for their heads, than we need to find someone else. You can call it Detroit and General Motors if you want, but I like a lot of the late seventies/early eighties stuff that GM built, great cars. There's a beautiful '77 Monte Carlo around the corner from my house for best offer. And what about Zinn? Seriously. I consider Zinn the man. Well, maybe not Zinn, but Chomsky for sure. Someone clear this up for me, I find it all very confusing.

Who is the motherfucking man?

teflon.


Billie Joe Armstrong : making Margot_Dent swoon for about 7 years and counting.

Good point...

Still funny

How dare you have a sense of humor