"Woman Is the Nigger of the World" is a John Lennon song, I don't think it can really be held to be offensive in context

I don't believe in gay and straight, I only believe in people being attracted to certain people, and for some people that's ONLY ever men and for some it's ONLY ever women, but for the majority there's a huge range inbetween where we fall. How many guys have never looked at another guy and said "you know what, he's fucking hot"? I'm guessing very few, and most men go through a homoerotic stage in adolescence where there's a definite "gay" undercurrent to their friendships with each other, and lets not forget that most of my gay friends have had sex with women too, at some point.

To me, being "gay" or "straight" is the same as being attracted to curvy girls, or girls with tattoos or guys with beards or whatever. It's just a preference. Now, that doesn't mean you can consciously change who you are attracted too, just that who you are attracted to doesn't mean jack shit about you.

From all the things I've read over the years, your sexual preferences seem to be the result of both nature and nurture, to use the old cliche, and as such is pretty much in line with the rest of your personality.

Plus, i buy him barbies on his second birthday...........

I don't know about that. Seems like the comment was spot in context and on point. I don't see how you're any more eloquent than he is, Saraphine. I wasn't offended, and it's hard for me to see why anyone should be. I don't believe that he called anyone the "n" word, or was using it as a tool of racism or hate. So what's your problem with what he said?

[Edited on Feb 26, 2006 by Puuck]

Someone needs to take a break from this thread. It looks like you are getting riled up/offended over peoples opinions (which they have every right to post as long as they stay within certain boundaries). Just remember dear, internet opinions are like assholes....... every bodies got 'em.

I understand the sentence differently than yours.


I think he wanted to say women are treated as black people were treated when the whole world called them "niggers".

That's just YOUR truth. You can find the sexual act between two men is disgusting but it has nothing to do here I think.
If you are for gay rights, maybe you can consider calling a part of their life "shit" is not very nice.

And maybe you can consider why culturally two girls are "hot".

Sorry, but this is absurd. There's an awful lot about human behaviour we simply don't know. There is much that "culture" and social conditioning alone do not explain satisfactorily.

And since many of our cultural behaviours can be interpreted in the light of biological imperatives, what does it mean to even talk of nature "versus" culture?

I love the "sorry" and the "absurd".

Nature versus culture mean we are enable right now to distinguish what is the part of the nature in a behaviour because we are so social it is very hard to distinguish nature and culture.
Regarding the study. Maybe there is a part of genetics in sexuality (which I doubt considering ethology and ethnology), but our social behaviours are so important they "cover" the natural behaviours.

Considering greek Antiquity I will say a lot of mothers have a "X chromosome inactivation".
It will explain why male homosexuality was so important. The end of male homosexuality (as social rule) can only be explained by an important genetical revolution. .

Good, now lets drink!

You're very welcome.

One simple test any theory of homosexuality has from the natural side is:
- how do "gay genes" get passed on such that homosexuality continues to be observed, as the person with the "gene" (the gay person) isn't likely to reproduce?

One simple test any theory of homosexuality has from the cultural side is:
- how do we explain the observation of kids who grow up miserable, being gay in an environment where being gay is stigmatized, and puts the child at rosk of ostracisation and harm? Many kids who grow up gay don't feel like they've "chosen" their orientation, and wish that they could feel "normal" like everyone else.

So ... y'know ... we keep looking for ways to answer these questions plausibly.

Saying that "we know all (or most) behaviour is social" is just unhelpful.

Saraphine, you might not be aware of it, but he was quoting that well-reknowned "racist" John Lennon. Who had a song titled "Woman is the Nigger of the World." There's nothing necessarily wrong with using the N-bomb if you use it thoughtfully and make clear what you mean by its use. I think he probably could have used some more context in that quote, but I got what he was saying.