By now you're probably familiar with the story of the University of Florida student who was tasered during a forum with Sen. John Kerry. In the course of asking Kerry about his membership in Skull and Bones, he was forcibly removed from the microphone and "escorted" to the back of the auditorium, loudly protesting all the while.
As has been noted, neither Kerry nor the majority of the other students participating in the forum did anything to stop this from happening. However, about 2,000 miles away at Colorado State University, students sympathetic to the recently tasered Andrew Meyer published a response, which has left the paper approximately $30,000 poorer in advertising dollars so far.
Colorado State University's student newspaper has lost $30,000 in advertising and had to cut pay and other budgets by 10 percent because of fallout from the use of a four-letter word in an editorial about President Bush, the Coloradoan reported Saturday.
In large type, the editorial included the words "Taser this ... Fuck Bush." The editorial said it had the support of the Collegian's editorial board.
"As local and national media will inevitably jump on this controversy, I strongly urge the university community to try and understand that the intentions of the students on staff, including me, were not to cause harm, but rather to reinforce the importance of free speech at our great institution," Editor-in-Chief J. David McSwane said in a posting on the paper's Web site Friday.
I can understand being up at arms about the Bush administrations "approach" to civil liberties, and I can totally jive with wanting to "make a statement people couldn't ignore," as the paper's Editor-in-Chief says he wanted to do, but "Fuck Bush"? That's not original, intelligent, or creative. How about "Fuck Kerry." That would be more to the point, after all, and your advertisers probably wouldn't have as big a problem with it.
The Collegian, a free publication funded entirely by advertising and published Monday through Friday printed comments, including negative ones on its Web site.
"Like many other comments here, I'm quite ashamed to see the official voice of my alma mater's paper choosing to express itself like this," wrote one commenter under the name Phil Mills. "Regardless of the Editors' opinion of our President, I would have hoped that they could have come up with something more eloquent and reasoned to express that opinion than this... this... bumper sticker."
The fact that Kerry continued to numbly "answer" Meyer's question even as the kid was being tasered and screaming "Help" and "Owwww" in agony is absurd and pathetic. Publishing an editorial response in a college paper that reads "Taser this ... Fuck Bush," is a close second.
Perhaps worst of all are the other students and (presumably) faculty who didn't respond. What would you do in that situation? Stand idly by, or speak up and act out?
scotts0 said:
That kid is a pompous dipshit who thought he could say and do whatever he wanted and wanted to use his 20 seconds on the microphone to get some recognition by thinking he could put Kerry on the spot. Not to mention, the video doesn't show what the kid said or asked prior to the Secret Society question. For all we know he could have badgered Kerry about another question and was warned.
That's simply your assumption. There are plenty of videos out there that show the entire incident. Gut feelings are not facts.
And I can honestly say that if I were in that crowd I would be laughing at that kid for a few reasons, one of which being did anyone else notice how quickly he went from being Mr. Cool Guy on Campus to "heelllppp meeeeeee, they're arresting me!!! somebody heeelllpppp meee pllllleeeaaaasseeee!!!!! why won't anyone help meeeee????" If you can't do the time don't do the crime...asshole.
And what crime was that, that he supposed committed?
My point is: shouldn't the police be the more responsible when reacting to situations like this? How is the use of a tazer in this situation justifiable?
You have clearly not been paying attention. Resisting arrest. 'Nuff said. Yo do that, things get all sparkly, and not in a way you'll enjoy. Or would you prefer a club? Or mace? Or a boot in the face? All of these things were also justifiable possibilities. Thank the powers that be for the little punk's sake that they chose the least injurious method.
Ah, so you're advocating fascism then. Good to know.
spinysquid said:
easy question. he should have appealed to the officers to let the young man up and let him leave unobstructed. 'the young man poses no threat to me officers. if he is disrupting the forum to an extent that you must remove him, please do so in a quick and orderly fashion. no tasering will be necessary.'
Oh grow the fuck up. It's not like Kerry had time to sit and type out the above bullshit monologue like you did just in case something like this might happen. It happened out of the blue, he asked the cops to let him answer the question, but once it became clear that the police were going to remove him he had absolutely zero authority over the situation. Again, he's just a politician. He's not Emperor Palpatine. He can't snap his fingers and have the police just stop what they're doing.
bullshit monologue? thanks, buddy. any politician worth his salt should have been able to take control of that situation in an instant. kerry was the reason the cops were there. he could have easily diverted the situation by suggesting to the guards to deal with the situation quickly and non-violently. you grow the fuck up, subrosa. the kid was obviously made responsible for his disruptive actions, but everyone involved failed in epic fashion. the irreverent kid failed to make his point, the dipshit cops failed to properly do their jobs and john kerry failed to take control of the forum, even though he was the focus of the room, and the only one in the room with a microphone.
as an aside to heathen dave ; at what point was this kid a threat to anybody in the auditorium? please explain that to me. granted, he resisted arrest, but he was being DISRUPTIVE at most. from the video i saw, he used a tone of voice that was irreverant and anti-authoritative. isnt that allowed in the constitution? maybe we should amend the constitution so it only protects free speech 'which heathendave deems as non-threatening.'
go back to cop school, you failed the first time. if you think he posed a threat to anybody in the auditorium other than himself, and merely by exercising his right to free speech, you are deluding yourself.
KUNGFOO said:
A privately held event isn't a accurate description at all. A US Senator made a public appearance at a major state University where this kid was a student. You're making it sound like a wedding. I not saying this kid didn't overreact to the situation, but the police did their fair share in escalating it. So I ask again... what crime did he supposed commit, that justified how the campus police reacted? I don't buy what you've written above as a justification for using a tazer.
It was an event held by a private group, and they invited Kerry. It's up to them who they want in there. That leads to the crime, he was asked to leave and refused, so that's trespassing. Officers attempted to escort him out, which would have been the end of it, but instead he broke free repeatedly and became a danger to himself and others. Or at least I gather that's the reasoning.
What private group? I haven't heard anything about a private group. Could you link them here? Because from every news article I've read about this incident seemed to make the implication that this was a University event. I could be mistaken though. BTW, a student organization isn't a private group, it still falls under the University.
Regardless, I'm still not clear on what actual crime was committed here. He was charged with resisting arrest and disturbing the peace, but wasn't that the result of the police escalation?
KUNGFOO said:
I haven't argued that the kid wasn't an obnoxious jackass. From the looks of his website, he'd seem like the type of person we'd mock here for spouting off crazy conspiracy theories. I could really give a fuck about the kid.
My point is: shouldn't the police be the more responsible when reacting to situations like this? How is the use of a tazer in this situation justifiable?
It's hard to say, as I'm not an officer, but using a tazer on a college age male who is writhing on the ground resisting efforts to be cuffed doesn't seem like too much. Tazers hurt, but only for a few seconds, and he could do serious harm to himself resisting the handcuffs. Tazers really aren't all that bad, they're not subtle and therefore really set bystanders of, but they're really not dangerous to use, and work wonders against people resisting custody.
I've never been "tazed", but I work with electronics. Electricity is fucking dangerous. You can die from electricity. You can cause serious injury to yourself with electricity. Electricity is really fucking dangerous.
Tasers should be used as an alternative to lethal force, not to make cop's lives easier. Kid should have been simply removed from the room.
And that's besides the fact if they just would have let him ask his stupid question, like John Kerry suggested, this whole incident wouldn't have happened. Everybody with at least average intelligence would have simply rolled their eyes and we would have all moved on. Since there's the claim that he wants attention, did the cops give him exactly what he wanted?
spinysquid said:
as an aside to heathen dave ; at what point was this kid a threat to anybody in the auditorium? please explain that to me. granted, he resisted arrest, but he was being DISRUPTIVE at most. from the video i saw, he used a tone of voice that was irreverant and anti-authoritative. isnt that allowed in the constitution? maybe we should amend the constitution so it only protects free speech 'which heathendave deems as non-threatening.'
go back to cop school, you failed the first time. if you think he posed a threat to anybody in the auditorium other than himself, and merely by exercising his right to free speech, you are deluding yourself.
1) He was a threat to other people in the audience once he began flailing and running about trying to get away from the police.
Reaver said:
Sure, blame the President because the security guards in Florida attacked some jackass who could have been some crazy lunatic out to kill a US Senator (Such as he is).
It's all on GW, because Kerry couldn't say 'Hey, stop tasering that asshole!'.
It's so clear to me.
thanks for clearing that up!
82
_kungfoo_
Los Angeles, CA
April 2005
SEP 23, 2007 10:57 AM
Heathen_Dave said:
...people are going to believe whatever they want to believe.
Yup, that is a human trait.
It's called opinion. It's a good idea to use a informed reasoning process to shape it though.
See in a fascist country, that kid would not have asked his one stupid and retarded question to try and put Kerry on the stop because they would have arrested him at the screening.
Granted, since I heard he skipped the screening anyhow, in that case they would have grabbed him and given him the beating of a lifetime right there in front of everyone.
Then dragged him outside and shot him in the fucking head with an AK-47, before rounding up his family for interrogation and likely execution.
And they certainly would not have let anyone tape it.
What happened here was not fascism, it was a fucking kid being a dousche.
Of course, no one can blame the kid. They need to blame George Bush, John Kerry, and the cops who were there to maintain order (such as it was).
Mister 'I'll get up and walk away' should have done that before the six cops pinned him to the ground and cuffed him, and he should have stopped fighting when they first mentioned a tasering.
85
_kungfoo_
Los Angeles, CA
April 2005
SEP 23, 2007 11:08 AM
Reaver said:
See in a fascist country, that kid would not have asked his one stupid and retarded question to try and put Kerry on the stop because they would have arrested him at the screening.
Granted, since I heard he skipped the screening anyhow, in that case they would have grabbed him and given him the beating of a lifetime right there in front of everyone.
Then dragged him outside and shot him in the fucking head with an AK-47, before rounding up his family for interrogation and likely execution.
And they certainly would not have let anyone tape it.
What happened here was not fascism, it was a fucking kid being a dousche.
Of course, no one can blame the kid. They need to blame George Bush, John Kerry, and the cops who were there to maintain order (such as it was).
Mister 'I'll get up and walk away' should have done that before the six cops pinned him to the ground and cuffed him, and he should have stopped fighting when they first mentioned a tasering.
You taken every thing said here and twisted it to suit your inane rant.
spinysquid said:
as an aside to heathen dave ; at what point was this kid a threat to anybody in the auditorium? please explain that to me. granted, he resisted arrest, but he was being DISRUPTIVE at most. from the video i saw, he used a tone of voice that was irreverant and anti-authoritative. isnt that allowed in the constitution? maybe we should amend the constitution so it only protects free speech 'which heathendave deems as non-threatening.'
go back to cop school, you failed the first time. if you think he posed a threat to anybody in the auditorium other than himself, and merely by exercising his right to free speech, you are deluding yourself.
1) He was a threat to other people in the audience once he began flailing and running about trying to get away from the police.
2) Stop talking before you hurt yourself.
'stop talking before you hurt yourself.'
magnificent argument.
'flailing and running about' ;
wow, serious threat.
youre the one impugning himself with his own bull-headed myopia, buddy. and, no, i wont 'stop talking', just because some smug punk-ass im dealing with reckons himself an authority on the matter. it just sounds like you have a problem with free speech in general ; again, symptomatic of a closed-minded idiot. all hail heathendave, or get a boot up your ass. let me guess, young republicans?
spinysquid said:
youre the one impugning himself with his own bull-headed myopia, buddy. and, no, i wont 'stop talking', just because some smug, punk-ass im dealing with reckons himself an authority on the matter. it just sounds like you have a problem with free speech in general ; again, symptomatic of a closed-minded idiot. go fly your dick cheney flag some more, because you sound just like him. all hail heathen dave, or get a boot up your ass.
You are so woefully ignorant of both what happened with Meyer and who I am that I can't even imagine where to start. So I won't.
a student of a public university attended a public function at another public university. he attended the function with an agenda, and when he began to exercise his agenda via free-speech, the crowd groaned in disdain. cops interceded when the students voice reached a tone which they were trained to view as threatening and dangerous. the politician speaking at the function began to answer the students question, but it was too late. the cops had already began to 'take control' of the situation. the student resisted arrest, at which point he was forcibly and somewhat violently removed from the auditorium. his only mistake was resisting arrest. he was never a threat to anybody. the police used the tasers too soon.
woefully ignorant?
i couldnt care less who you are, specifically until you stop being a closed-minded douchebag. nobody has once made an argument here that the kid wasnt responsible for his own actions. he was never a threat to anybody in the auditorium. ever. he resisted arrest.
but, i must admit, youve piqued my curiosity now. who are you? you imply, perhaps, that you are personally involved on some level, or that you know something i dont. if this is true, please enlighten my obviously ignorant point of view.
spinysquid said:
a student of a public university attended a public function at another public university. he attended the function with an agenda, and when he began to exercise his agenda via free-speech, the crowd groaned in disdain. cops interceded when the students voice reached a tone which they were trained to view as threatening and dangerous. the politician speaking at the function began to answer the students question, but it was too late. the cops had already began to 'take control' of the situation. the student resisted arrest, at which point he was forcibly and somewhat violently removed from the auditorium. his only mistake was resisting arrest. he was never a threat to anybody. the police used the tasers too soon.
Not what happened. Not gonna keep going with this though.
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Comments
_kungfoo_
Los Angeles, CA
April 2005
SEP 23, 2007 10:14 AM
teddy__kgb
Albuquerque, NM
February 2007
SEP 23, 2007 10:29 AM
_kungfoo_
Los Angeles, CA
April 2005
SEP 23, 2007 10:39 AM
Heathen_Dave
Birmingham, AL
July 2005
SEP 23, 2007 10:45 AM
Heathen_Dave
Birmingham, AL
July 2005
SEP 23, 2007 10:48 AM
JunkyardAngel
San Gabriel, CA
February 2006
SEP 23, 2007 10:53 AM
_kungfoo_
Los Angeles, CA
April 2005
SEP 23, 2007 10:57 AM
JunkyardAngel
San Gabriel, CA
February 2006
SEP 23, 2007 10:58 AM
Reaver
I'm lost
August 2003
SEP 23, 2007 11:03 AM
_kungfoo_
Los Angeles, CA
April 2005
SEP 23, 2007 11:08 AM
teddy__kgb
Albuquerque, NM
February 2007
SEP 23, 2007 11:20 AM
Heathen_Dave
Birmingham, AL
July 2005
SEP 23, 2007 11:32 AM
teddy__kgb
Albuquerque, NM
February 2007
SEP 23, 2007 11:58 AM
teddy__kgb
Albuquerque, NM
February 2007
SEP 23, 2007 11:59 AM
Heathen_Dave
Birmingham, AL
July 2005
SEP 23, 2007 12:52 PM
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