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  • SUNDAY SEPTEMBER 2 2007 4:00 PM

Choice and Class

Submitted by Bitch_PhD

Edited by Bitch_PhD

Tags: motherhood, feminism, class, mommy wars, choice, choice feminism



A pretty good--but not perfect--editorial in the San Francisco Chronicle about choice, class, and the so-called "Mommy Wars":

The debate over whether mothers of young children should . . . opt out, (or) choose to stay home -- reveals its bias: It assumes that all mothers can make a choice that, in actuality, very few mothers are in a position to make.

For most mothers, working full time is not a choice to be weighed against having a family; it's a necessity in order to support a family.
....
It's easy to open a newspaper and get the impression that parenting is a challenge faced only by upper-middle-class people. . . . Should children enroll in science or soccer camp?
....
for low-income mothers, summer brings a different set of challenges: finding a new means of child care now that the days aren't filled with classroom instruction.


As the article points out, this kind of thing is a feminist problem--

The recent obsession with the Mommy Wars and its out-and-out refusal to consider these differences in an area where socioeconomic class makes a huge difference has been puzzling to many feminists. It's 2007. The idea that class matters in, well, matters of class, is not exactly the complex syllogism it once was.

Or perhaps it is. The Mommy Wars' blatant disregard of its impact on lower-income mothers has resulted in something worse than a reversion to second-wave feminism of the 1970s, which favored a simplistic focus on giving women a choice without considering economic and cultural differences.
....
In essence, it's an onslaught of negative third-wave feminism, which assumes everyone has the financial security to make a choice and tells low-income and poor mothers that this doesn't concern them


--but it's a false feminist problem. That is to say, the media portrayal of "women's issues" as exclusively belonging to (mostly) white, upper middle class women is not something that comes from feminists (and no, not even "third-wave" feminists, who are well aware, thankyouverymuch, that class and race matter). It's something that comes from sexism. The only women who "count" are women who have the money and hence the collective power to affect advertisers. Poor women? If we pay attention to them, they're "the poor"--issues specific to women either get ignored or get presented as the results of "poor choices" (interesting use of the word, no?) like having "too many" kids "too young"--which presumably means before landing that six-figure-earning husband. Women of color? Oh, racism no longer exists, didn't you know? Immigrant women? They shouldn't have "chosen" to cross the border illegally.

It's not a coincidence that the overblown hype about the "Mommy Wars" only serves to convince people that feminism is trivial (after all, what's more trivial than being a mommy?), self-involved, and at best a hobby of privileged women. But if you go around and read what self-declared feminists actually write about, you'll find a whole 'nother picture.

The Chronicle's right that the problem is the assumption that "everyone" has enough money to "choose" to do the right thing. An assumption that contains an unstated premise that even those of us who are comfortably middle- to upper-middle class often have bad luck or make "bad choices"--but since we "matter," our choices are cushioned by the ability to refinance, to borrow in emergencies, to take out student loans, to ask mom or dad to help us find a job or loan us a little bit to tide us over, to coast on our husband's or wife's health insurance, to pay for a babysitter, to join a gym, to see a doctor. Even knowing that things like student loans are available is a privilege of the middle class: think about how much of the stuff you know about money and getting by is stuff someone else told you about, or someone you know did before you.

The Chronicle concludes by saying that "The Mommy Wars can be won when we redefine victory." It's not the mommy wars that are the problem though: the real problem is a media-manufactured class privilege that relies on hidden classism, racism, and sexism. The "war" will be won when people start realizing that most people, mommies and parents especially, do their damn best. And that therefore any problem you can generalize about is not simply a matter of "good" or "bad" "choices."

Bitch_PhD passes in public as a soccer mom, and can't decide if that's funny or terrifying.

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BridgeTwnPeddler

BridgeTwnPeddler

Portland, OR
January 2003

SEP 02, 2007 04:32 PM

Excellent article. Too often I feel we don't talk about class when it seems it is more often at the root of a issue than gender or race.

mattacme

mattacme

Calistoga, CA
February 2006

SEP 02, 2007 04:53 PM

The presumptuousness of many who would imagine themselves either "Liberals" or "Feminists" (or any number of other labels) is deeply disturbing. Thanks for citing the SF Chronicle article.

Two points of my own to add...

1. The so called class war that we are witnessing is quite similar to others before it in the Capitalist age, in which the cult of money is dominant. The French Revolution, our own War of Independence, the labor movement that began in the late nineteenth century; these are all manifestations of the struggle that builds when one group has something that the other want and need. It is coming clearer at present because the consolidation of wealth is still in full swing, and will continue for the next half generation at least.

2. Its not a Feminist or Womens's issue any longer; it is a class war.

SockPuppet

SockPuppet

I'm lost
July 2006

SEP 02, 2007 05:17 PM

mattacme said:
The presumptuousness of many who would imagine themselves either "Liberals" or "Feminists" (or any number of other labels) is deeply disturbing. Thanks for citing the SF Chronicle article.

Two points of my own to add...

1. The so called class war that we are witnessing is quite similar to others before it in the Capitalist age, in which the cult of money is dominant. The French Revolution, our own War of Independence, the labor movement that began in the late nineteenth century; these are all manifestations of the struggle that builds when one group has something that the other want and need. It is coming clearer at present because the consolidation of wealth is still in full swing, and will continue for the next half generation at least.

2. Its not a Feminist or Womens's issue any longer; it is a class war.



I'm a little puzzled by this. What makes it a class war? I'd be grateful for sources.

curtisology

curtisology

USA
April 2006

SEP 02, 2007 05:25 PM

SockPuppet said:

mattacme said:
The presumptuousness of many who would imagine themselves either "Liberals" or "Feminists" (or any number of other labels) is deeply disturbing. Thanks for citing the SF Chronicle article.

Two points of my own to add...

1. The so called class war that we are witnessing is quite similar to others before it in the Capitalist age, in which the cult of money is dominant. The French Revolution, our own War of Independence, the labor movement that began in the late nineteenth century; these are all manifestations of the struggle that builds when one group has something that the other want and need. It is coming clearer at present because the consolidation of wealth is still in full swing, and will continue for the next half generation at least.

2. Its not a Feminist or Womens's issue any longer; it is a class war.



I'm a little puzzled by this. What makes it a class war? I'd be grateful for sources.



You're asking for sources of his opinion?

Morgan

Morgan

SUICIDEGIRL

Illinois, USA

SEP 02, 2007 05:31 PM

Yet another excellent article!

testykitten

testykitten

Andorra
February 2005

SEP 02, 2007 05:51 PM

curtisdead said:

SockPuppet said:

mattacme said:
The presumptuousness of many who would imagine themselves either "Liberals" or "Feminists" (or any number of other labels) is deeply disturbing. Thanks for citing the SF Chronicle article.

Two points of my own to add...

1. The so called class war that we are witnessing is quite similar to others before it in the Capitalist age, in which the cult of money is dominant. The French Revolution, our own War of Independence, the labor movement that began in the late nineteenth century; these are all manifestations of the struggle that builds when one group has something that the other want and need. It is coming clearer at present because the consolidation of wealth is still in full swing, and will continue for the next half generation at least.

2. Its not a Feminist or Womens's issue any longer; it is a class war.



I'm a little puzzled by this. What makes it a class war? I'd be grateful for sources.



You're asking for sources of his opinion?



two sources about the state of the US in terms of class war and the effects of globalization (US imperialism) on Americans.

"The Global Class War"
How America's Bipartisan Elite Lost Our Future and What It Will Take to Win It Back
by Jeff Faux

and these articles:

http://www.alternet.org/columnists/story/61355/

http://www.slate.com/id/2084002/

I do agree with mattacme that this country is facing a serious class war. however, since women and children are more vulnerable to poverty, i still consider it a feminist issue.

I also agree that not all third wave feminism is negative or classist. some of the most influential young feminist writers today (for me- Ariel Gore and Jessica Valenti) recognize classism and working class women's issues.

Gringo

Gringo

Spokane, WA
May 2006

SEP 02, 2007 06:03 PM

bosonuser said:
Excellent article. Too often I feel we don't talk about class when it seems it is more often at the root of a issue than gender or race.


Especially in this instance. Class has to play a role if there is going to be a debate as to which is better.

The only viable debaters would be those who have that option in the first place.

In a 1998 article from the Washington Post, it's clearly acknowledged that:

The only thing worse than making those choices is not having a choice at all.

BDeyeD

BDeyeD

Toronto, ON
January 2007

SEP 02, 2007 06:04 PM

testykitten said:
I do agree with mattacme that this country is facing a serious class war. however, since women and children are more vulnerable to poverty, i still consider it a feminist issue.



Exactly. These issues are not exclusionary. They all can (and most often DO) exist together and therefore need to be solved together.

SockPuppet

SockPuppet

I'm lost
July 2006

SEP 02, 2007 06:06 PM

curtisdead said:

SockPuppet said:

mattacme said:
The presumptuousness of many who would imagine themselves either "Liberals" or "Feminists" (or any number of other labels) is deeply disturbing. Thanks for citing the SF Chronicle article.

Two points of my own to add...

1. The so called class war that we are witnessing is quite similar to others before it in the Capitalist age, in which the cult of money is dominant. The French Revolution, our own War of Independence, the labor movement that began in the late nineteenth century; these are all manifestations of the struggle that builds when one group has something that the other want and need. It is coming clearer at present because the consolidation of wealth is still in full swing, and will continue for the next half generation at least.

2. Its not a Feminist or Womens's issue any longer; it is a class war.



I'm a little puzzled by this. What makes it a class war? I'd be grateful for sources.



You're asking for sources of his opinion?



No, I'm asking for the sources that (in-)formed his opinion. Definitions of class (with specific reference to the USA), for instance. Edit: I'll be offline for 20 hours or so, so no great rush. Thanks.

testykitten

testykitten

Andorra
February 2005

SEP 02, 2007 06:22 PM

SockPuppet said:

curtisdead said:

SockPuppet said:

mattacme said:
The presumptuousness of many who would imagine themselves either "Liberals" or "Feminists" (or any number of other labels) is deeply disturbing. Thanks for citing the SF Chronicle article.

Two points of my own to add...

1. The so called class war that we are witnessing is quite similar to others before it in the Capitalist age, in which the cult of money is dominant. The French Revolution, our own War of Independence, the labor movement that began in the late nineteenth century; these are all manifestations of the struggle that builds when one group has something that the other want and need. It is coming clearer at present because the consolidation of wealth is still in full swing, and will continue for the next half generation at least.

2. Its not a Feminist or Womens's issue any longer; it is a class war.



I'm a little puzzled by this. What makes it a class war? I'd be grateful for sources.



You're asking for sources of his opinion?



No, I'm asking for the sources that (in-)formed his opinion. Definitions of class (with specific reference to the USA), for instance. Edit: I'll be offline for 20 hours or so, so no great rush. Thanks.



^^^^^^^^^

i'm of a similar opinion so i cited some sources for you.

freshprncebelair

freshprncebelair

Ellicott City, MD
June 2004

SEP 02, 2007 08:01 PM

mattacme said:
The presumptuousness of many who would imagine themselves either "Liberals" or "Feminists" (or any number of other labels) is deeply disturbing. Thanks for citing the SF Chronicle article.

Two points of my own to add...

1. The so called class war that we are witnessing is quite similar to others before it in the Capitalist age, in which the cult of money is dominant. The French Revolution, our own War of Independence, the labor movement that began in the late nineteenth century; these are all manifestations of the struggle that builds when one group has something that the other want and need. It is coming clearer at present because the consolidation of wealth is still in full swing, and will continue for the next half generation at least.

2. Its not a Feminist or Womens's issue any longer; it is a class war.



What will be interesting is how the class war is resolved in an era where capital is global and flows across borders. Attempting to clamp down could create a mass of capital flight.

I know that my family has experienced a "class war" in Venezuala (with Chavez's party coming to power), and they took all the assets they could out of the country (they already had converted a lot of assets to gold due to inflation in the past).

Technology is creating the situation for the inequalities already present to widen considerably, and presents the options to avoid any sort of downside to one's actions.

xazapdmytinu

xazapdmytinu

Fort Collins, CO
July 2007

SEP 02, 2007 08:02 PM

Man, there's that "war" thing again...it's like adding "gate" onto every presidential scandal...any struggle is automatically made into a "war"...why is it that everything has to be a battle with only a few ways to victory and at the end there is a winner and a loser? Because that's what WAR implies...that somebody loses.

mattacme

mattacme

Calistoga, CA
February 2006

SEP 02, 2007 08:34 PM

BDeyeD said:

testykitten said:
I do agree with mattacme that this country is facing a serious class war. however, since women and children are more vulnerable to poverty, i still consider it a feminist issue.



Exactly. These issues are not exclusionary. They all can (and most often DO) exist together and therefore need to be solved together.



Agreed. And just to be clear, the challenges that women's reproductive choice are presented with are of course of the most immediate concern to women, but have tremendous effect on everyone. Thanks.

mattacme

mattacme

Calistoga, CA
February 2006

SEP 02, 2007 08:38 PM

testykitten said:

SockPuppet said:

curtisdead said:

SockPuppet said:

mattacme said:
The presumptuousness of many who would imagine themselves either "Liberals" or "Feminists" (or any number of other labels) is deeply disturbing. Thanks for citing the SF Chronicle article.

Two points of my own to add...

1. The so called class war that we are witnessing is quite similar to others before it in the Capitalist age, in which the cult of money is dominant. The French Revolution, our own War of Independence, the labor movement that began in the late nineteenth century; these are all manifestations of the struggle that builds when one group has something that the other want and need. It is coming clearer at present because the consolidation of wealth is still in full swing, and will continue for the next half generation at least.

2. Its not a Feminist or Womens's issue any longer; it is a class war.



I'm a little puzzled by this. What makes it a class war? I'd be grateful for sources.



You're asking for sources of his opinion?



No, I'm asking for the sources that (in-)formed his opinion. Definitions of class (with specific reference to the USA), for instance. Edit: I'll be offline for 20 hours or so, so no great rush. Thanks.



^^^^^^^^^

i'm of a similar opinion so i cited some sources for you.



Thanks. I am looking over your sources. Nice.

mattacme

mattacme

Calistoga, CA
February 2006

SEP 02, 2007 08:41 PM

SockPuppet said:

mattacme said:
The presumptuousness of many who would imagine themselves either "Liberals" or "Feminists" (or any number of other labels) is deeply disturbing. Thanks for citing the SF Chronicle article.

Two points of my own to add...

1. The so called class war that we are witnessing is quite similar to others before it in the Capitalist age, in which the cult of money is dominant. The French Revolution, our own War of Independence, the labor movement that began in the late nineteenth century; these are all manifestations of the struggle that builds when one group has something that the other want and need. It is coming clearer at present because the consolidation of wealth is still in full swing, and will continue for the next half generation at least.

2. Its not a Feminist or Womens's issue any longer; it is a class war.



I'm a little puzzled by this. What makes it a class war? I'd be grateful for sources.



Hi. I'm tied up feeding kids but will reply when I have a moment. Is mid-week too late? Another respondent posted some interesting sources as well.

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