Wait... he....

oh...

oh god....

*sobs*

PS - Honestly though, I think I figured it out when I was four or five, and it did not faze me one bit. I think it's only when you've been lied to until you're fucking 10 years old that you get really upset.

I refuse to believe that 10 year-olds anywhere believe in Santa or the Tooth Fairy.

It's much more humane to tell kids that Father Christmas did once exist, but that he died of asphyxiation whilst trying to climb down a smoking chimney. Worked for all those bloody carollers who were always knocking around here. I wonder whatever happened to those kids?

If christmas actually stood for anything anymore, and hadn't been utterly bastardised by having to remain PC so as not to offend people to whom the event doesn't even concern anyway, then i'd say it was worth you typing all the inane drivvel above.

Unfortunately, these days christmas is little more than a capitalist instrument by which the poor are kept poor by being encouraged to believe they need to waste all their money and/or get in debt to celebrate a poxy 24hrs one cold december.

You think they're killing the magic of christmas but is there anything left worth killing?

(humbug)

I can't remember how old I was when I figured it out. My parents waited until I was 13 before taking the actual step of telling me. By then of course I'd pretty much figured it out long since. A cousin of mine believed until at least 10 or maybe even 11, which worried me. What's normal, anyway? 7 or 8?

Are you always this much fun? You must be a joy at the proverbial office christmas party. Anyway no one to the left of Bill O'Rielly really believes there's some kind of a PC War on Xmas. Seriously, when's the last time you were told it was wrong to wish someone a Merry Xmas? It's bullshit. And don't the poor have enough feewill and self-control to decide for theselves what they can afford?

One of my better friends believed in Santa until he was about 14.

I'm going to side with, it hurts kids more to have their parents lie to them for ten years. I found out from my cousins when I was 3. My parents were upset, but I think I'm probably better adjusted for having learned.

wait...are you saying there IS no Santa?

Look there are millions of adults who believe in a benevolent bearded old guy who uses magic to provide gifts for all the good people. I think their called Christians, Muslims and Jews. The Buddist just have the fat guy with no beard.

Santa is cool. Believing in Santa is cool. Kids are not commerical and give fuck all about capitalism, communism, or any other isms for that matter. Santa isn't about or for adults or stores or commerce. Its about kids. Kids for the most part are completely innocent in that regard, and there is nothing wrong with letting them stay that way for as long as they can.

Santa offers children a chance for a little bit of magic in a time when people are on some kind of war path against anything and everything not completely PC.

It's not lying to your kids, its telling them a fantastic story and allowing them the opportunity to live in that story for a while.

As a icon Santa himself couldn't be more harmless. He doesn't carry a cross or other overt religious symbol (most people have no clue he wears red because the real saint nick was a cardinal), and while he is a symbol of Christmas, Santa is almost so far removed from anything having to do with Christ that you wonder whose holiday it is.

He gives out toys, he doesn't sell them or anything else. He says be good. That's it. And apart from the freaks from PETA who are spreading rumors about him using drugs to get the reindeer to fly and the American Heart Association, I can;t imagine what anyone would have against the guy.

If you aren't down with Santa thats fine. Your loss. But anyone who actively kills the myth for kids, whatever age they are, is someone who is just an asshole and shouldn't be the least bit surprised when some angry parent comes to deliver a little personal christmas cheer.

~S

Santa is dead. He remains dead, and we killed him!

pah - the way things are in engerland some of those 9year olds will have kids of their own in 2 or 3 years - they'll find out the truth about St Nick then.

I dunno, truth and lies are complicated concepts, certaily moreso than you're making out. Teaching and encouraging children to believe in abstract concepts seems important to me, and instilling in them the idea that there may be more to the world than the mundane seems fundamentally important. In that sense I think ideas like "Santa Claus" are important to the mental maturity of a kid. At the same time something like Santa, which at some point most children grow to believe isn't real, may not be the best tool for this.

I think a better answer to a kid who asks "is Santa real?" would be "I don't know." It's the truth in the most strict sense of the word know, and it leaves room for a more interesting world than the one we live in. I guess I might have a different perspective than a lot of people around here though, I don't think ideas like religion or myth have to be either/or propositions. They have their own reality in the way they shape our minds.

All that said I don't see why people are making such a big deal of teachers telling kids these sorts of things; asking kids to think critically about what they believe in seems worthwhile to me.