IPOD
RADIO
Gretchen Mol star of The Notorious Bettie Page
By Daniel Robert Epstein
Apr 14, 2006
When I spoke with Mary Harron last summer, she told me that while she was auditioning women for the role of Bettie, “After Gretchen Mol came in no one else would do.” After years of seeing Mol is supporting roles I wasn’t convinced. Well Mol is amazing in The Notorious Bettie Page. She creates a complex character that actually seems to enjoy posing. She creates the dynamic of a religious woman who does what she does best and that’s posing in bondage and cheesecake photos.
Check out the official website for The Notorious Bettie Page
Daniel Robert Epstein: When Bettie Page poses in the film she seems like the happiest person ever, was that in the script?
Gretchen Mol: It was in the feeling of the script. But also you can’t look at those photographs of her and not believe that she was tapping into some joyous part of herself when she was posing.
DRE:
Did you see what Bettie Page did as a feminist act?
GM:
Because I’d read interviews with her I knew that she didn’t take that on herself. She wasn’t trying to do anything but her job and she had this non-judgmental spirit. People were always able to look at Bettie Page and see what they needed her to be and she gave them that permission to do so. So in that way she’s a feminist but I don’t think she was ever trying to be.
DRE:
What about you personally?
GM:
Looking back on it, yes I think she was highly evolved in her way of seeing her own sexuality. She didn’t see the shame or the harm in doing the things that she was doing. In that way I would call her a feminist.
DRE:
You really became her onscreen, how were you able to channel her so well?
GM:
It was that lack of self consciousness that she had when she was posing. I thought if I can get 60 percent of that I’d be in good shape. Well maybe that wouldn’t have been enough [laughs]. But I really knew that was the key to her talent in front of the camera. She had that complete, healthy attitude about her own nakedness and her lack of shame. With knowing that, she seemed to be able to create that for herself in front of the camera while in her own life maybe she knew that she wasn’t as successful.
DRE:
Was she ahead of her time with that unselfconsciousness or was she just naïve?
GM:
I don’t think she was naïve. The attitude of the 1950’s was to pick and choose what you looked at deeply. Nobody was going to force that on her. She didn’t really come in contact with the people that were looking at and using her photographs. For her it was a job and I don’t think she was naïve about it but I think she was doing her job as best as she could and she was not judgmental about the men or the people that were interested in bondage photography and fetish.
DRE:
Did you get to meet Bettie Page?
GM:
I didn’t. But there was a lot of source material for me. There were so many photographs and there were a couple of interviews which helped me find her voice, which was very important. There were loop reels as well so at a certain point it became about letting go of all of the information and stepping into her shoes.
DRE:
Was it hard to get into her head?
GM:
It was because there were a lot of contradictions. As you said, there were some things that seemed naïve and then there was another part of her that showed she’s very aware of it all but not wanting to look at it. I think her psychology was very interesting which made it not the typical biopic.
DRE:
Bettie comes off smarter than any other character in the film, was that part of your thinking?
GM:
I didn’t really approach it that way, although I felt that I had such a respect for Bettie’s point of view. She was smart in that she didn’t have those prejudices. She seemed to be evolved past the typical sexual bondage of the 1950’s.
DRE:
She could have gone on to be Marilyn Monroe but she was stuck in that world.
GM:
She could have done stag films but she didn’t. She could have slept with the producer and been ambitious about her movie career, but she didn’t. So it would be interesting to see what she would do today. She was so able to tap into her true creative self when she was posing for photographs that she wasn’t able to do with her acting. This was a time when actors were digging into their own psychologies and using that drama in their work and Bettie wasn’t able to do that.
DRE:
How was being in Bettie’s bondage wear for the movie?
GM:
Well I look at those photographs and she always had a wink and a twinkle behind her eye. They didn’t have the darkness that you might think. When you look at pictures like that today there certainly is a darkness in the world of S & M but I didn’t feel that this is what they were doing. She gave you that permission in her pictures.
DRE:
The movie shows that she was molested by her father. Was her posing for those photos an act of rebellion?
GM:
I wanted to be careful with connecting those dots. Yes if you look at women in a sexual trade, many of them have had some form of abuse but that would have been simplifying Bettie Page too much. There is so much more complexity than that but that certainly factored into it. What’s interesting to me is that not only did she end up in this world but she excelled in it in such a unique way. She seemed to be getting as much out of it as the audience.
DRE:
Would this film have been much different had it been directed by a man?
GM:
Probably. Based on Mary’s past work, I knew what she was interested in from this character and that’s what I was interested in as well.
DRE:
Is the film entirely accurate?
GM:
It’s very accurate. Bettie will tell the stories that are show in the movie. Even with how subtle the thing with her father is, that’s about as much as you’ll ever find about that. She would talk about it but you’re not sure what exactly happened.
DRE:
Was there anything about Bettie that surprised you personally but didn’t wind up in the film?
GM:
There’s a Richard Foster biography of Bettie Page which goes into her later life after her modeling heyday when she had suffered some breakdowns. It was an interesting choice of Mary’s to focus on the 1950’s and Bettie Page almost as a catalyst.
DRE:
Young actresses in the business are almost seen as objects than as actual artists. What was your experience?
GM:
I never felt that way about myself. Sure there’s the media and you do have to be careful of that. I’ve been pretty lucky in that I have a good family and I know my limits.
DRE:
Have you gotten calls from Playboy and would you do it?
GM:
I wouldn’t. There were inquiries because of the movie and because Bettie was a pinup in Playboy.
DRE:
Have you been getting more interesting scripts since this film has been shown?
GM:
It’s hard to know really how it’s going to happen, but the career ebbs and flows and now there’s a nicer feeling of interest than there has been at other times.
DRE:
Back when Rounders was being released there was a lot of buzz about your career, did that hurt or help you?
GM:
It’s been so long now. But I don’t have any regrets. I’ve been able to learn from my experiences and try to get take the value from them.
DRE:
What are you working on now?
GM:
Right now I’m working on a film called Trainwreck: My Life as an Idiot. It’s a dark comedy with Seann William Scott and my cousin Tod Harrison Williams is directing it.
by Daniel Robert Epstein
SG Username: AndersWolleck
When I spoke with Mary Harron last summer, she told me that while she was auditioning women for the role of Bettie, “After Gretchen Mol came in no one else would do.” After years of seeing Mol is supporting roles I wasn’t convinced. Well Mol is amazing in The Notorious Bettie Page. She creates a complex character that actually seems to enjoy posing. She creates the dynamic of a religious woman who does what she does best and that’s posing in bondage and cheesecake photos.
Check out the official website for The Notorious Bettie Page
Daniel Robert Epstein: When Bettie Page poses in the film she seems like the happiest person ever, was that in the script?
Gretchen Mol: It was in the feeling of the script. But also you can’t look at those photographs of her and not believe that she was tapping into some joyous part of herself when she was posing.
DRE:
Did you see what Bettie Page did as a feminist act?
GM:
Because I’d read interviews with her I knew that she didn’t take that on herself. She wasn’t trying to do anything but her job and she had this non-judgmental spirit. People were always able to look at Bettie Page and see what they needed her to be and she gave them that permission to do so. So in that way she’s a feminist but I don’t think she was ever trying to be.
DRE:
What about you personally?
GM:
Looking back on it, yes I think she was highly evolved in her way of seeing her own sexuality. She didn’t see the shame or the harm in doing the things that she was doing. In that way I would call her a feminist.
DRE:
You really became her onscreen, how were you able to channel her so well?
GM:
It was that lack of self consciousness that she had when she was posing. I thought if I can get 60 percent of that I’d be in good shape. Well maybe that wouldn’t have been enough [laughs]. But I really knew that was the key to her talent in front of the camera. She had that complete, healthy attitude about her own nakedness and her lack of shame. With knowing that, she seemed to be able to create that for herself in front of the camera while in her own life maybe she knew that she wasn’t as successful.
DRE:
Was she ahead of her time with that unselfconsciousness or was she just naïve?
GM:
I don’t think she was naïve. The attitude of the 1950’s was to pick and choose what you looked at deeply. Nobody was going to force that on her. She didn’t really come in contact with the people that were looking at and using her photographs. For her it was a job and I don’t think she was naïve about it but I think she was doing her job as best as she could and she was not judgmental about the men or the people that were interested in bondage photography and fetish.
DRE:
Did you get to meet Bettie Page?
GM:
I didn’t. But there was a lot of source material for me. There were so many photographs and there were a couple of interviews which helped me find her voice, which was very important. There were loop reels as well so at a certain point it became about letting go of all of the information and stepping into her shoes.
DRE:
Was it hard to get into her head?
GM:
It was because there were a lot of contradictions. As you said, there were some things that seemed naïve and then there was another part of her that showed she’s very aware of it all but not wanting to look at it. I think her psychology was very interesting which made it not the typical biopic.
DRE:
Bettie comes off smarter than any other character in the film, was that part of your thinking?
GM:
I didn’t really approach it that way, although I felt that I had such a respect for Bettie’s point of view. She was smart in that she didn’t have those prejudices. She seemed to be evolved past the typical sexual bondage of the 1950’s.
DRE:
She could have gone on to be Marilyn Monroe but she was stuck in that world.
GM:
She could have done stag films but she didn’t. She could have slept with the producer and been ambitious about her movie career, but she didn’t. So it would be interesting to see what she would do today. She was so able to tap into her true creative self when she was posing for photographs that she wasn’t able to do with her acting. This was a time when actors were digging into their own psychologies and using that drama in their work and Bettie wasn’t able to do that.
DRE:
How was being in Bettie’s bondage wear for the movie?
GM:
Well I look at those photographs and she always had a wink and a twinkle behind her eye. They didn’t have the darkness that you might think. When you look at pictures like that today there certainly is a darkness in the world of S & M but I didn’t feel that this is what they were doing. She gave you that permission in her pictures.
DRE:
The movie shows that she was molested by her father. Was her posing for those photos an act of rebellion?
GM:
I wanted to be careful with connecting those dots. Yes if you look at women in a sexual trade, many of them have had some form of abuse but that would have been simplifying Bettie Page too much. There is so much more complexity than that but that certainly factored into it. What’s interesting to me is that not only did she end up in this world but she excelled in it in such a unique way. She seemed to be getting as much out of it as the audience.
DRE:
Would this film have been much different had it been directed by a man?
GM:
Probably. Based on Mary’s past work, I knew what she was interested in from this character and that’s what I was interested in as well.
DRE:
Is the film entirely accurate?
GM:
It’s very accurate. Bettie will tell the stories that are show in the movie. Even with how subtle the thing with her father is, that’s about as much as you’ll ever find about that. She would talk about it but you’re not sure what exactly happened.
DRE:
Was there anything about Bettie that surprised you personally but didn’t wind up in the film?
GM:
There’s a Richard Foster biography of Bettie Page which goes into her later life after her modeling heyday when she had suffered some breakdowns. It was an interesting choice of Mary’s to focus on the 1950’s and Bettie Page almost as a catalyst.
DRE:
Young actresses in the business are almost seen as objects than as actual artists. What was your experience?
GM:
I never felt that way about myself. Sure there’s the media and you do have to be careful of that. I’ve been pretty lucky in that I have a good family and I know my limits.
DRE:
Have you gotten calls from Playboy and would you do it?
GM:
I wouldn’t. There were inquiries because of the movie and because Bettie was a pinup in Playboy.
DRE:
Have you been getting more interesting scripts since this film has been shown?
GM:
It’s hard to know really how it’s going to happen, but the career ebbs and flows and now there’s a nicer feeling of interest than there has been at other times.
DRE:
Back when Rounders was being released there was a lot of buzz about your career, did that hurt or help you?
GM:
It’s been so long now. But I don’t have any regrets. I’ve been able to learn from my experiences and try to get take the value from them.
DRE:
What are you working on now?
GM:
Right now I’m working on a film called Trainwreck: My Life as an Idiot. It’s a dark comedy with Seann William Scott and my cousin Tod Harrison Williams is directing it.
by Daniel Robert Epstein
SG Username: AndersWolleck
by Daniel Robert Epstein
SG Username: AndersWolleck
