Michael Paul Stephenson and George Hardy: Troll 2 and Best Worst Movie
Take outtakes from every Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings fan film ever made. Throw in rabid hatred for vegetarianism and paint it with a veneer of cannibalism and an understanding of witchcraft and paganism gleaned from artifacts bought at a Spencer's Gifts store. Chop all that up with a pound and a half of generic Alophen and feed it to something feral that you find eating the marrow of road kill in Nevada. The cinematic ejecta from this experiment, if viewed with mouthfuls of peyote, might come close to the experience of watching Italian director Claudio Fragasso's 1990 direct-to-video abomination Troll 2, generally considered the worst movie ever made (or at least the equal of Ed Wood's Plan 9 from Outer Space).
Flash forward to the next Millennium. Filmmaker Michael Paul Stephenson, the child star of Troll 2, discovers there's an underground network of fans who kept the movie alive with their themed parties, screenings, energy, love, and devotion. After spending twenty years of his life running away from it, Stephenson turned around and faced the beast; He decided to make a documentary about Troll 2, the unlikely cult that it spawned, and the lives of several of his co-stars from the film. His documentary, Best Worst Movie, has been playing the festival circuit to great acclaim -- and rabid fan response. Meanwhile, Troll 2 continues to find new followers; It even invaded Iraq along with our troops.
SG talked to Stephenson and to Alabama dentist George Hardy, who in 1989 played the now-sort-of-iconic role of Michael Waits (aka Farmer Waits), the father of Stephenson's character. Hardy, a charismatic guy who seems to have Dale Carnegie's How to Win Friends and Influence People tattooed on his DNA, is also one of the main subjects of the Best Worst Movie documentary.
Michael Marano: Michael, a lot of documentary filmmakers have gone to Iraq to address more serious topics than Troll 2. How did you go about getting footage from Iraq of soldiers watching Troll 2?
Michael Paul Stephenson: About a week before we finished the teaser [for Best Worst Movie], I get this e-mail from this guy named Adam Corella, who was a Special Operations soldier in Iraq...He says, "I heard about these screenings, and I wanted to let you know that I'm a huge fan and I actually brought Troll 2 over to Iraq with me and have been showing it to people on base.
It was probably a couple of days after that we e-mailed him and talked to him on the phone and he said, "Yeah! I'm having another Troll 2 screening this week." I said, "Can you film it and get as much footage as possible?" And he said, "Oh, yea! Of course! It's not a problem!"
I had the teaser just about done at that point, but I held off on finishing it until I saw the Iraq footage. About a week later, I got about nine or ten hours of footage of soldiers in Iraq watching the movie...I went through it all, and included it in the original teaser...So, that's how Iraq came into the whole thing!
It was probably a couple of days after that we e-mailed him and talked to him on the phone and he said, "Yeah! I'm having another Troll 2 screening this week." I said, "Can you film it and get as much footage as possible?" And he said, "Oh, yea! Of course! It's not a problem!"
I had the teaser just about done at that point, but I held off on finishing it until I saw the Iraq footage. About a week later, I got about nine or ten hours of footage of soldiers in Iraq watching the movie...I went through it all, and included it in the original teaser...So, that's how Iraq came into the whole thing!
MM:
I had images of you getting special visas to go film over there.
MPS:
If there was any way I could get over there, I would be on a plane next week.
MM:
So you cut a teaser together for funding. How do you sell people on this idea of "There's this really bad movie that I made when I was 10, and I want to make a documentary it?" That's a hard sell.
MPS:
It's a very hard sell. It's such a process when you're working on a project for four years...I moved to LA, this was about five years ago, with the intention of writing and filmmaking and continuing to act...I was doing the LA "meeting casting directors, and talking to people" thing. I don't know how much you know about this city, but there's just a lot of bullshit.
MM:
In LA???
MPS:
It was tiresome to me, and it was wearing. It was during this period of time...I had been receiving these e-mails from Troll 2 fans.
MM:
How were they finding you?
MPS:
Through MySpace. I'd get these messages that would say, "Are you Joshua Waits?" And on IMDB I'd see some things posted and I would respond. But I was hesitant. I really didn't understand what was going on. But I was intrigued. As soon as I started to open that door a little bit, I started making friendships with a lot of these people...
[It was] during that same period that I just woke up smiling during a couple of mornings. I remember just staring up at the ceiling and saying, "Wait a minute, I'm the star of the worst movie ever made!" I thought, there's a story here, I've got to make a documentary about this. So I wrote up a treatment...
And I got an e-mail, out of the blue again...from a producer in LA. He said, "I just wanted to let you know I'm a huge Troll 2 fan...and I've done some movies with Lionsgate, and if you ever had any projects, I'd love to have you come in and pitch it."
I go in and I meet with him and another gentleman...[This second producer] was, to me, a typical Hollywood dirtbag. He was like, "Have you ever had girls who wanted to sleep with you because of your Troll 2 fame?"
I was just thinking, what the hell is this? I was just kind of turned off by it. It felt weird coming out of there. They said, "OK, you can be the star and be the center [of the documentary]!" All of the creative notes that I was getting from them didn't feel right....
So, [my costars from Troll 2 and I] go to New York [for a special screening by the comedy troupe, The Upright Citizen's Brigade]. I didn't know who was going to be the center of the film at that time. We'd all gone to dinner and were going back to the [Upright Citizen's Brigade] theater, and there was this line all the way around the block. For a split second, we thought, "This couldn't be for Troll 2?"
All of a sudden people started recognizing George. And the fans were just going crazy, yelling "Farmer Waits!" and "George!" He just lit up....George all of a sudden had like a hundred friends in line. [He was] signing autographs and having the time of his life....And George, when they did the introductions when he came on stage, everyone just cheered and went crazy, and I remember thinking, "That's the guy for this story!"
I kept thinking of the contrast of him being in Alabama and being this dentist -- this was his first and last movie -- and then all of a sudden coming to New York and being like a movie star.
So long story short, I come back from New York and met with these producers. I said, "I want to focus on George. He's going to be the vehicle for this thing because he's a small town Alabama guy, and he's a movie star at these screenings, and I like that angle. I think there's [something] very human about it too that would relate to a larger audience than just [Troll 2] fans."
They just basically just said, "No. The age range for this kind of movie is your age, you should be the center of it." They offered me a fourth of what I said I needed to do it, and they said, "Can you have it done in four to six weeks?" I just kind of rolled my eyes and said, "You've got to be kidding me. There's no way I feel comfortable with that." And they just kind of said, "well, there's the door!" But once I'd seen what had happened in New York, there was no turning back for me.
[It was] during that same period that I just woke up smiling during a couple of mornings. I remember just staring up at the ceiling and saying, "Wait a minute, I'm the star of the worst movie ever made!" I thought, there's a story here, I've got to make a documentary about this. So I wrote up a treatment...
And I got an e-mail, out of the blue again...from a producer in LA. He said, "I just wanted to let you know I'm a huge Troll 2 fan...and I've done some movies with Lionsgate, and if you ever had any projects, I'd love to have you come in and pitch it."
I go in and I meet with him and another gentleman...[This second producer] was, to me, a typical Hollywood dirtbag. He was like, "Have you ever had girls who wanted to sleep with you because of your Troll 2 fame?"
I was just thinking, what the hell is this? I was just kind of turned off by it. It felt weird coming out of there. They said, "OK, you can be the star and be the center [of the documentary]!" All of the creative notes that I was getting from them didn't feel right....
So, [my costars from Troll 2 and I] go to New York [for a special screening by the comedy troupe, The Upright Citizen's Brigade]. I didn't know who was going to be the center of the film at that time. We'd all gone to dinner and were going back to the [Upright Citizen's Brigade] theater, and there was this line all the way around the block. For a split second, we thought, "This couldn't be for Troll 2?"
All of a sudden people started recognizing George. And the fans were just going crazy, yelling "Farmer Waits!" and "George!" He just lit up....George all of a sudden had like a hundred friends in line. [He was] signing autographs and having the time of his life....And George, when they did the introductions when he came on stage, everyone just cheered and went crazy, and I remember thinking, "That's the guy for this story!"
I kept thinking of the contrast of him being in Alabama and being this dentist -- this was his first and last movie -- and then all of a sudden coming to New York and being like a movie star.
So long story short, I come back from New York and met with these producers. I said, "I want to focus on George. He's going to be the vehicle for this thing because he's a small town Alabama guy, and he's a movie star at these screenings, and I like that angle. I think there's [something] very human about it too that would relate to a larger audience than just [Troll 2] fans."
They just basically just said, "No. The age range for this kind of movie is your age, you should be the center of it." They offered me a fourth of what I said I needed to do it, and they said, "Can you have it done in four to six weeks?" I just kind of rolled my eyes and said, "You've got to be kidding me. There's no way I feel comfortable with that." And they just kind of said, "well, there's the door!" But once I'd seen what had happened in New York, there was no turning back for me.
MM:
George, you're the star of the original Troll 2 film, you're the hero of the Best Worst Movie documentary, and you're famous in your home town from your appearances dressed up as a rollerblading molar at local events promoting dental health. You're a star three times over!
George Hardy: Yeah, I guess you can say that! [Laughs] But only for a small group of people. It's all reaching a large crowd now.
MM:
What's it like being a triple threat?
GH:
[Still laughing] It's all kind of crazy, isn't it? For me, I don't know if it would be surreal or not but, when I guess I found out that I was involved with the miracle of the phenomenon around Troll 2, and Troll 2 becoming a cult classic, I thought, "Why not just join the ride, and enjoy this whole process?" Michael and I had no idea where [Best Worst Movie] would lead and we realized after going to some of the screenings that the fans just loved my character Farmer Waits...
I found it fascinating that so many people just loved the part I played. I've had people tell me, "You're like my real dad." I'm like a blast from the past to them I guess. But it's kind of bigger than life for many of them to see me now, 20 years later. Because for somebody to walk off the screen and be right in front of them, that they can touch or talk to, or shake hands with.
What I've done is to just embrace it because for so long -- you can ask most all the cast members -- we all just ran from Troll 2...We were deeply embarrassed...I never really watched the movie until the first public screening. I'd never watched the whole thing. I would try to sit through it with my daughters and I would get up and go get something to eat or I would walk out. Or I would find myself losing attention for it, because I was embarrassed.
I found it fascinating that so many people just loved the part I played. I've had people tell me, "You're like my real dad." I'm like a blast from the past to them I guess. But it's kind of bigger than life for many of them to see me now, 20 years later. Because for somebody to walk off the screen and be right in front of them, that they can touch or talk to, or shake hands with.
What I've done is to just embrace it because for so long -- you can ask most all the cast members -- we all just ran from Troll 2...We were deeply embarrassed...I never really watched the movie until the first public screening. I'd never watched the whole thing. I would try to sit through it with my daughters and I would get up and go get something to eat or I would walk out. Or I would find myself losing attention for it, because I was embarrassed.
MM:
In the context of the Troll 2 fandom, do you feel like a father figure?
GH:
It feels like the character I play is more of the heroic figure than the father figure. To me, the father figure feels more like Grandpa Seth [the benevolent ghost who helps little Joshua fight the evil goblin antagonists].
MM:
Now, I know you were a cheerleader...
GH:
In college, yeah...
MM:
Is appearing at Troll 2 and Best Worst Movie screenings sort of analogous to cheerleading in terms of interaction with the audience and building audience enthusiasm?
GH:
It's in the same spirit of something that feels fun, or fun loving or very spirited...I guess the word that would feel the same for both would be "promoting." When I was cheerleading in college, you were promoting your school. Now, I'm promoting a documentary and a movie that I was in...
MM:
There's some serious moments of pathos in Best Worst Movie. It's not all just funny. You've got Margo Prey, who played your wife in the movie, who is now looking after her elderly mother. You've got Robert Ormsby, the elderly guy who played Grandpa Seth saying in the documentary, "I've frittered away my life." And you've got Don Packard, who played the evil general store owner, who has had all these mental health problems.
GH:
For me, I think what's beautiful about the film is its honesty. Michael was able to get into the true psyche of all of us of the cast he chose to represent in Best Worst Movie. And I think we all represent truths. Yes, you could call it sad, but it's true. There are many individuals that have frittered their lives away. There are a lot of people who have some mental challenges in life. And there are some people that caretake their moms, and who want to live their dreams but never did. I think it's so profound and deep to so many people. When you want to call these moments sad -- yes, they are -- but they're the truth. Why hide the truth of what happens to so many? Why hide that feeling that people can identify with? I think that's what makes it so profound, the movie itself.
MM:
You really had no idea what was going on with Margo when you and Michael went to her house?
GH:
I did not. What I found about her, when we interviewed her, was that she's very loving, very tenderhearted, and very sweet individual...and so is everyone that we interviewed. Michael was able to show their uniqueness. I found there was a great deal of respect for each of the individuals he interviewed, especially Margo. I think Michael played that in a sensitive way.
MM:
Michael, when will Best Worst Movie be released to general audiences outside the festival circuit?
MPS:
It's looking like this fall, but I can't confirm anything right now.
MM:
Will this be a DVD release?
MPS:
Well, actually, we're putting together a strategy for a theatrical release. DVD and digital and TV, that's all a given, we're on the edge of working all that out. Now, we're trying to figure out a way to go back to all these cities where there were Troll 2 screenings and create a kind of special release.
We've been doing the festivals, and all the festivals have been going remarkably well, which we're so grateful for. We've gotten really great reception. Most of these people...at the festivals had never seen or heard of Troll 2 before, which was so important to me at the beginning -- that the story could reach out to beyond just the fans.
I've come to the conclusion that this documentary actually plays better to people who haven't seen Troll 2, because you're getting the i[]Troll 2 experience for the very first time...In Austin, after our Best Worst Movie screening, Troll 2 was #3 among all Netflix rentals in the state of Texas...So, I think there's a real interesting opportunity to take Troll 2 and the documentary and plan some kind of special event type of release...and plan these kinds of events around the "worst movie ever made" and show both and leave the prints of the documentary for a week or two in each city.
Watch Troll 2 on HULU HERE.
For more on Michael Paul Stephenson's documentary featuring George Hardy and others from the cast of Troll 2 go to: BestWorstMovie.com.
We've been doing the festivals, and all the festivals have been going remarkably well, which we're so grateful for. We've gotten really great reception. Most of these people...at the festivals had never seen or heard of Troll 2 before, which was so important to me at the beginning -- that the story could reach out to beyond just the fans.
I've come to the conclusion that this documentary actually plays better to people who haven't seen Troll 2, because you're getting the i[]Troll 2 experience for the very first time...In Austin, after our Best Worst Movie screening, Troll 2 was #3 among all Netflix rentals in the state of Texas...So, I think there's a real interesting opportunity to take Troll 2 and the documentary and plan some kind of special event type of release...and plan these kinds of events around the "worst movie ever made" and show both and leave the prints of the documentary for a week or two in each city.
Watch Troll 2 on HULU HERE.
For more on Michael Paul Stephenson's documentary featuring George Hardy and others from the cast of Troll 2 go to: BestWorstMovie.com.
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