Boards > Sex Talk > Wow, you really let yourself go.

Keith

Oklahoma City, OK

August 2002

NOV 07, 2005 10:08 AM

So if you marry some person and two years into an otherwise happy union, your S.O. is walking down Fifth avenue, and gets run over by a runaway fire engine, and is horribly, irrevocably, disfigured and you bail; Doesn't that make you some kind of dick?

Oddly enough, part of me thinks that you would be justified in leaving someone who has become horribly disfigured if it was that much of a problem for you. Expecting someone to be loyal to you at the expense of their own happiness is just as selfish as leaving someone because they aren't the same person you married (physically, at least). I always figured that the thing that made love so good was the uncertainty of it. If you want someone who'll always be there for you, maybe you're better off getting a dog?

I'm not sure how much of what I just said is what I actually believe. I'm just trying to generate conversation, or something.

For better, or for worse... in sickness, and in health...

Hooraydiation

Boston, MA

October 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:19 AM

Cash said:

FridgeMagnet said:
I think that's even more reason to stay. Imagine it happened to you. You become horribly disfigured, and the biggest fear that goes through your mind is, "Noone is ever going to Love me again, noone is ever goint to want me again." And then your spouse basically proves that theory right.

If you love someone enough to marry them, you love their heart and their soul and their mind. You may like their face and their tits, and their ass, but that shit all comes with an expiration date anyway. I think if you leave because they become disfigured in an accident, you never fucking loved them to begin with. Because if you did, your heart wouldn't let you leave them.

I think that's a lovely way to think...and it's certaily noble...but I don't think you can guarantee you'd feel the same until you were put in the situation..which I sincerely hope never happens.

Honestly...if I were horribly disfigured in an accident...I'd most likely hole up in my apartment and drink myself to death in solitary.

I'd bandage my face up and take to wearing a trenchcoat and a fedora.

And I also don't think you can say a person who leaves someone after they became disfigured never loved them in the first place without having an intimate knowledge of both partiest. Love ends for a variety of reasons and they don't all have to be "good". Who is really in a position to say where love does and doesn't exist?

On a side not, say my falling in love with someone comes largely as a result of their sharp mind. If they become dull-witted in their old age whereas I do not, does choosing to leave them make me as bad as someone who left their SO for getting fat?

FridgeMagnet

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 10:21 AM

Cash said:

FridgeMagnet said:
I think that's even more reason to stay. Imagine it happened to you. You become horribly disfigured, and the biggest fear that goes through your mind is, "Noone is ever going to Love me again, noone is ever goint to want me again." And then your spouse basically proves that theory right.

If you love someone enough to marry them, you love their heart and their soul and their mind. You may like their face and their tits, and their ass, but that shit all comes with an expiration date anyway. I think if you leave because they become disfigured in an accident, you never fucking loved them to begin with. Because if you did, your heart wouldn't let you leave them.

I think that's a lovely way to think...and it's certaily noble...but I don't think you can guarantee you'd feel the same until you were put in the situation..which I sincerely hope never happens.

Honestly...if I were horribly disfigured in an accident...I'd most likely hole up in my apartment and drink myself to death in solitary.

Just to be clear I wasn't casting aspersions on you, Cash. And you're right that until the thing actually happens all the rest is conjecture. But I stand by my comment.

[Edited on Nov 07, 2005 by FridgeMagnet]

Hooraydiation

Boston, MA

October 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:21 AM

Keith said:

Kid_Dangerbot said:

So if you marry some person and two years into an otherwise happy union, your S.O. is walking down Fifth avenue, and gets run over by a runaway fire engine, and is horribly, irrevocably, disfigured and you bail; Doesn't that make you some kind of dick?

Oddly enough, part of me thinks that you would be justified in leaving someone who has become horribly disfigured if it was that much of a problem for you. Expecting someone to be loyal to you at the expense of their own happiness is just as selfish as leaving someone because they aren't the same person you married (physically, at least). I always figured that the thing that made love so good was the uncertainty of it. If you want someone who'll always be there for you, maybe you're better off getting a dog?

I'm not sure how much of what I just said is what I actually believe. I'm just trying to generate conversation, or something.

For better, or for worse... in sickness, and in health...

Who came up with that anyway?

FridgeMagnet

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 10:24 AM

Kid_Dangerbot said:

Cash said:

FridgeMagnet said:
I think that's even more reason to stay. Imagine it happened to you. You become horribly disfigured, and the biggest fear that goes through your mind is, "Noone is ever going to Love me again, noone is ever goint to want me again." And then your spouse basically proves that theory right.

If you love someone enough to marry them, you love their heart and their soul and their mind. You may like their face and their tits, and their ass, but that shit all comes with an expiration date anyway. I think if you leave because they become disfigured in an accident, you never fucking loved them to begin with. Because if you did, your heart wouldn't let you leave them.

I think that's a lovely way to think...and it's certaily noble...but I don't think you can guarantee you'd feel the same until you were put in the situation..which I sincerely hope never happens.

Honestly...if I were horribly disfigured in an accident...I'd most likely hole up in my apartment and drink myself to death in solitary.

I'd bandage my face up and take to wearing a trenchcoat and a fedora.

And I also don't think you can say a person who leaves someone after they became disfigured never loved them in the first place without having an intimate knowledge of both partiest. Love ends for a variety of reasons and they don't all have to be "good". Who is really in a position to say where love does and doesn't exist?

On a side not, say my falling in love with someone comes largely as a result of their sharp mind. If they become dull-witted in their old age whereas I do not, does choosing to leave them make me as bad as someone who left their SO for getting fat?

My biggest problem with marriage as an institution is how carelessly people jump into it, and how callously people jump out of it. Life isn't perfect, it's not supposed to be. Nowhere was anyone ever guaranteed a happy life. What if you have a kid that has severe mental handicaps. Do you just throw them in the fucking dumpster because they're making you sad? Oh well, my love for my child ended because it wasn't what I thought it would be. I'll just smoke a bowl and move on. That mentality and it's implications for society, scares the shit out me.

[Edited on Nov 07, 2005 by FridgeMagnet]

FridgeMagnet

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 10:26 AM

Kid_Dangerbot said:

Keith said:

Kid_Dangerbot said:

So if you marry some person and two years into an otherwise happy union, your S.O. is walking down Fifth avenue, and gets run over by a runaway fire engine, and is horribly, irrevocably, disfigured and you bail; Doesn't that make you some kind of dick?

Oddly enough, part of me thinks that you would be justified in leaving someone who has become horribly disfigured if it was that much of a problem for you. Expecting someone to be loyal to you at the expense of their own happiness is just as selfish as leaving someone because they aren't the same person you married (physically, at least). I always figured that the thing that made love so good was the uncertainty of it. If you want someone who'll always be there for you, maybe you're better off getting a dog?

I'm not sure how much of what I just said is what I actually believe. I'm just trying to generate conversation, or something.

For better, or for worse... in sickness, and in health...

Who came up with that anyway?

Regardless of who came up with it, a shitload of people take it as an oath, without really meaning it.

cretinfamily

Tulsa, OK

March 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:26 AM

FridgeMagnet said:

Kid_Dangerbot said:

Cash said:

FridgeMagnet said:
I think that's even more reason to stay. Imagine it happened to you. You become horribly disfigured, and the biggest fear that goes through your mind is, "Noone is ever going to Love me again, noone is ever goint to want me again." And then your spouse basically proves that theory right.

If you love someone enough to marry them, you love their heart and their soul and their mind. You may like their face and their tits, and their ass, but that shit all comes with an expiration date anyway. I think if you leave because they become disfigured in an accident, you never fucking loved them to begin with. Because if you did, your heart wouldn't let you leave them.

I think that's a lovely way to think...and it's certaily noble...but I don't think you can guarantee you'd feel the same until you were put in the situation..which I sincerely hope never happens.

Honestly...if I were horribly disfigured in an accident...I'd most likely hole up in my apartment and drink myself to death in solitary.

I'd bandage my face up and take to wearing a trenchcoat and a fedora.

And I also don't think you can say a person who leaves someone after they became disfigured never loved them in the first place without having an intimate knowledge of both partiest. Love ends for a variety of reasons and they don't all have to be "good". Who is really in a position to say where love does and doesn't exist?

On a side not, say my falling in love with someone comes largely as a result of their sharp mind. If they become dull-witted in their old age whereas I do not, does choosing to leave them make me as bad as someone who left their SO for getting fat?

My biggest problem with marriage as an institution is how carelessly people jump into it, and how callously people jump out of it. Life isn't perfect, it's not supposed to be. Nowhere was anyone ever guaranteed a happy life. What if you have a kid that has severe mental handicaps. Do you just throw them in the fucking dumpster because they're making you sad? Oh well, my love for my child ended because it wasn't what I thought it would be. I'll just smoke a bowl and move on. That mentality and it's implications for society, scares the shit out me.

^^^^^this man knows of that which he speaketh of.

Darke

Columbia, MO

June 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:40 AM

crap..... suits me right for not logging onto my account instead of the hubbies

[Edited on Nov 07, 2005 by Darke]

almalthia

I'm lost

August 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:43 AM

Do what will make you happy. If you love the lady, stay and help her improve, if you don't, say your goodbyes and be done. The worst relationship is a couple where love is not shared, but becomes a chore for one party or the other. When that happens, the relationship is founded on a lie that is being upheld by societies silly notion that marriage is forever.

Marriage is not forever, the whole till death do us part, in sickness and in health idea was created in an age where people lived to the ripe old age of 30, perhaps 40. It was easy to stand by your husband or wife in those times because most sickness would kill you, or you'd both starve to death when life took a turn for the worse.

Changes

Boston, MA

October 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:54 AM

FridgeMagnet

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 10:58 AM

almalthia said:

Marriage is not forever, the whole till death do us part, in sickness and in health idea was created in an age where people lived to the ripe old age of 30, perhaps 40. It was easy to stand by your husband or wife in those times because most sickness would kill you, or you'd both starve to death when life took a turn for the worse.

Cop Out. Don't fucking say it if you don't fucking mean it. Plus what about all the 20 and 30 somethings who get the majority of divorces after 3-5 years of marriage? How does that fit into that construct?

We are a disposable bullshit society. We are taught from day one that the only thing that matters is our moment to moment contentedness. If it feels good do it, and damn the fucking consequences. All my friends are getting married, I'll get married, it's so the thing to do. Oh wait, it's not easy, fuck it, let's get divorced, no big deal. Hey all my friends are having kids, I'll have a kid, oh the kid is a pain in the ass, and my husband or wife is a drag I'm outta here. Fuck it.

PointBlank

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:03 AM

almalthia said:
Do what will make you happy. If you love the lady, stay and help her improve, if you don't, say your goodbyes and be done. The worst relationship is a couple where love is not shared, but becomes a chore for one party or the other. When that happens, the relationship is founded on a lie that is being upheld by societies silly notion that marriage is forever.

Marriage is not forever, the whole till death do us part, in sickness and in health idea was created in an age where people lived to the ripe old age of 30, perhaps 40. It was easy to stand by your husband or wife in those times because most sickness would kill you, or you'd both starve to death when life took a turn for the worse.

Then why get married? Why not just live in "sin?" Seriously, the whole point of marriage is to be together forever. . .otherwise, don't fucking do it. Why is that so fucking hard for people to understand. It's sort of silly that you call staying together a lie based on "societies silly notion," when marriage is just a silly notion, constructed by society!

FridgeMagnet

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:07 AM

PointBlank said:

almalthia said:
Do what will make you happy. If you love the lady, stay and help her improve, if you don't, say your goodbyes and be done. The worst relationship is a couple where love is not shared, but becomes a chore for one party or the other. When that happens, the relationship is founded on a lie that is being upheld by societies silly notion that marriage is forever.

Marriage is not forever, the whole till death do us part, in sickness and in health idea was created in an age where people lived to the ripe old age of 30, perhaps 40. It was easy to stand by your husband or wife in those times because most sickness would kill you, or you'd both starve to death when life took a turn for the worse.

Then why get married? Why not just live in "sin?" Seriously, the whole point of marriage is to be together forever. . .otherwise, don't fucking do it. Why is that so fucking hard for people to understand. It's sort of silly that you call staying together a lie based on "societies silly notion," when marriage is just a silly notion, constructed by society!

Fucking thank you.

Hooraydiation

Boston, MA

October 2005

NOV 07, 2005 11:19 AM

ClubsBabySeals said:
That is NOT the singulary point of marriage. It is from a conservative, religious fundamentalist view point. However there is also MANY civil considerations involved like where inheritance and right of attorney is concerned. So it isn't solely societal either but also legal and civil.

Great point, by the way.

[Edited on Nov 07, 2005 by Kid_Dangerbot]

Keith

Oklahoma City, OK

August 2002

NOV 07, 2005 11:21 AM

Luckily, I wasn't all that sexy when she met me.

PointBlank

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:25 AM

ClubsBabySeals said:

PointBlank said:

almalthia said:
Do what will make you happy. If you love the lady, stay and help her improve, if you don't, say your goodbyes and be done. The worst relationship is a couple where love is not shared, but becomes a chore for one party or the other. When that happens, the relationship is founded on a lie that is being upheld by societies silly notion that marriage is forever.

Marriage is not forever, the whole till death do us part, in sickness and in health idea was created in an age where people lived to the ripe old age of 30, perhaps 40. It was easy to stand by your husband or wife in those times because most sickness would kill you, or you'd both starve to death when life took a turn for the worse.

Then why get married? Why not just live in "sin?" Seriously, the whole point of marriage is to be together forever. . .otherwise, don't fucking do it. Why is that so fucking hard for people to understand. It's sort of silly that you call staying together a lie based on "societies silly notion," when marriage is just a silly notion, constructed by society!

That is NOT the singulary point of marriage. It is from a conservative, religious fundamentalist view point. However there is also MANY civil considerations involved like where inheritance and right of attorney is concerned. So it isn't solely societal either but also legal and civil.

[Edited on Nov 07, 2005 by ClubsBabySeals]

First off, I'm very far from a conservative, religious person. Secondly, inheritance and right of attorney are easily granted without being married. It's just not as romantic.

To get to the original question: To me, when you get married, you're saying "I'm at the point where my love is so strong, that you could lose a limb, gain a million pounds, start voting Republican and I will still be there for you." If the original poster had said "If I'm not attracted to my girlfriend any more, is breaking up ok? " I would have said, "Dump away, my friend!"

I'm not ready to take that gamble, myself.

[Edited on Nov 07, 2005 by PointBlank]

PointBlank

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:27 AM

ClubsBabySeals said:
I think it is humorous to think about how many of the people on this site that bash christianity and organized religion will also get married in a church and/or presided over by a priest/minister/rabi.

It's like saying you'll tell the truth but crossing your fingers at the same time.

[Edited on Nov 07, 2005 by ClubsBabySeals]

Exactly my point. Why do it if you don't mean it?

PointBlank

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:39 AM

ClubsBabySeals said:
I agree that amrriage is a stronger bond for some people...but just as you used the words "to me" when making your statement, then other people's "to me" statement should be valid as well. If someone elses "to me" statement is "I want to get married but if a key part of my williness to get married vanishes(physical and/or sexual attraction) then I reserve the right to leave" then I believe that is fine to.

I agree. So put it in the marriage agreement.

PointBlank

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:46 AM

The question wasn't "are you allowed to leave if you're not attracted" because, obviously you are "allowed" to. The question was whether or not it's right. And, no, in my opinion it is pretty shitty to dump someone you agreed to be with forever just because they don't look like what they once looked like.

PointBlank

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:53 AM

ClubsBabySeals said:

PointBlank said:
The question wasn't "are you allowed to leave if you're not attracted" because, obviously you are "allowed" to. The question was whether or not it's right. And, no, in my opinion it is pretty shitty to dump someone you agreed to be with forever just because they don't look like what they once looked like.

I understand completely.
I happen to think it is OK for someone to do that without any morality judgements(which is all it boils down to when asking if it's "OK") put on them.

[Edited on Nov 07, 2005 by ClubsBabySeals]

Well, then you'd have to agree that you could dump your wife for any reason without any morality judgements, wouldn't you?

TheJuanupsman

Hopkins, MN

April 2004

NOV 07, 2005 12:03 PM

The physical isssues are fine. I can adapt to those and if I like you, as a person, I am going to find you attractive even if you do have some physical changes that most people would consider unaesthetic. It's the personality changes that are hard. I realize that everyone changes, but sometimes the changes are in opposite directions and too extreme. I never wanted to be married to a soccor mom, who drives a minivan, thinks shopping is the greatest thing in existance and whose idea of a good time is sitting in bed watching Soap operas. And that wasn't who I married. Where did that fun girl I married go.

Then again I an no longer the shy, bookish, moderate guy who hated going out that she met 20+ years ago. Every year I become a little less mainstream. Every year she becomes a little more. It's hard. I'm trying. But it just isn't easy.

[Edited on Dec 10, 2005 by TheJuanupsman]

Morgan

SUICIDEGIRL

Illinois, USA

NOV 07, 2005 01:03 PM

I think leaving someone who had gone through significant physical changes without ever talking to them about your concerns or your lack of attraction to them because of those changes would be pretty rotten.

However, if you talk to them about your concerns and they make no effort (not just for your partnership but for their own health) to stop a ton of weight gain...I don't know. You can't always control attraction. If you're not attracted to someone at all anymore, for whatever reason, the relationship isn't going to work. It isn't fair to expect anyone to stay in a relationship where there is no physical attraction.

tehpeanut

Houston, TX

September 2005

NOV 07, 2005 01:19 PM

it shouldnt matter what the other person looks like years down the line..if you love someone and chose to marry them then it should have been based on love and feelings not appearance...yes you should have some attraction but it shouldnt be based on that and that alone...

bluevalentine

San Antonio, TX

December 2003

NOV 07, 2005 01:29 PM

ClubsBabySeals said:

>>There are some things that can NOT be granted without marriage or civil union. For instance in states that don't allow gay marriage. If a couple adopts a child and the person(because only one can adopt the child as a single parent since marriage isn't allowed) that legally adopts that child dies years down the road, then that person's "life partner" and the person that child has grown to know as Mom or Dad will NOT be able to keep that child and that child may go into foster care.<<

this is what coparent adoption is for.

And if you cant have your ducks in a row, then hold off on adopting until you do.

Parenthood. something ELSE people rush into.

And I for one am one of those people who got married too soon and for all the wrong reasons.

And I do feel like I did wrong by doing so and will not get married again for fear of acting the same way again

BOARDS:

TOPICS:

Oklahoma City, OK

August 2002

NOV 07, 2005 10:08 AM

Boston, MA

October 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:19 AM

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 10:21 AM

Boston, MA

October 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:21 AM

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 10:24 AM

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 10:26 AM

Tulsa, OK

March 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:26 AM

Columbia, MO

June 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:40 AM

almalthia

I'm lost

August 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:43 AM

Boston, MA

October 2005

NOV 07, 2005 10:54 AM

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 10:58 AM

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:03 AM

Chicago, IL

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:07 AM

Boston, MA

October 2005

NOV 07, 2005 11:19 AM

Oklahoma City, OK

August 2002

NOV 07, 2005 11:21 AM

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:25 AM

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:27 AM

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:39 AM

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:46 AM

New York, NY

November 2004

NOV 07, 2005 11:53 AM

Hopkins, MN

April 2004

NOV 07, 2005 12:03 PM

SUICIDEGIRL

Illinois, USA

NOV 07, 2005 01:03 PM

Houston, TX

September 2005

NOV 07, 2005 01:19 PM

San Antonio, TX

December 2003

NOV 07, 2005 01:29 PM