When I was a teen, I took to swearing with great gusto. The movie Heathers was very hot among my friends then, and wed quote it with relish. Fuck me gently with a chainsaw! Why cant you just be a friend, why do you have to be such a megabitch? And Ill admit that since Ive always looked younger than my age, coupled with my small frame, I got even more pleasure from swearing like a sailor and shocking people. Sweet little Mur said WHAT?
Im not saying Id go up to old people in the malls and call them cunt blossoms or anything, but I didnt hold back when I was with my friends.
I did have limits, though. I remember reading an interview with Mike Tyson in Playboy a while back, where nearly every third word was fucking. I had to search for the story drowning in the sea of expletives.
There are made-up swear words. The ones that leap to mind of this geek are frell (from Farscape) and frack (from Battlestar Galactica). BSG fans found it hysterical that KFC completely missed the mark and advertised the Frack Pack on the opener a couple of weeks ago. Twitter was ablaze, They do know theyre selling a Fuck Pack, right? While the words do fit for network television, allowing our characters to swear as much as they want, they do sound a little watered down and sad.
I was surprised when people started reading my book and complaining to me of the swearing. I dont see why so many people need to say unnecessary swear words. Some of my friends say that its a gender thing: some people react more strongly to women swearing than men, and when I read the audio podcast of my novel, people could get turned off by sweet little Mur swearing like a character in Deadwood. Others say that the content of the book superheroes implies its safe for kids while the language is not. (Ever read Powers?)
But people havent told me theres too much murder in the book. Or too much torture. Or too much dismemberment (actually one person said there wasnt enough dismemberment, but we wont talk about him). People are immune to violence, but if you throw in some swearing, nudity, or (gasp) a gay character and theyll get their panties in a wad.
(As an aside, I just got done watching Season Two of Dexter on DVD, and Lila was a favorite character. She was not a trembling violet; she was brash, rude and sexual. When she was nude in the kitchen and Dexter's sister Deb walked in on her, Lila casually draped an arm across her breasts, smiled, and said, Pardon my tits. That was true to the character anything less wouldn't have fit.)
To research this more, I went to the pros. Both New York Times Bestselling Authors, Scott Sigler and Tracy Hickman are very different storytellers.
Sigler is the author of Infected and Contagious, scifi/horror thrillers that are peppered liberally with violence and swearing. He calls it asinine that people think they live in a pristine world. You have to use the language that fits the story, he says. If you don't, you're producing a contrived projection of the way you think the world should be. Not the way it is. Some people swear, therefore, it's logical if some characters swear.
I told him of the reader who hinted strongly that if I wrote stories and books without swearing, hed be a faithful supporter. Sigler said, It's a free market literary economy; if people don't like it, they can put it down. Just like they can turn the channel if they don't like what's on the TV.
When asked if hed ever consider cleaning up a work to appeal to an audience, he said, I have a book called The Rookie. It's about a futuristic football league; in football, people swear. But the sci-fi and sports elements of this tale make it ideal for teenagers and pre-teens, so I am modifying the cursing to suit that audience to bring it under the threshold most parents sustain for their children. Once people are old enough to make up their own minds, however, I let the story be what it needs to be, and the characters be what they need to be.
On the other side of the spectrum we have Tracy Hickman, bestselling fantasy author who is very active within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. He has a different opinion of the use of colorful language. He does swear in his books, but not very often. Swearing is like spice...If you do not use it the text feels unnatural and bland. If you use too much of it, it makes the whole [book] unpalatable.
He does add most people fall on the unpalatable side of the balance. The problem is that people today swear too much. Swearing is a crutch in conversation. It's what you say when you haven't got real words.
Hickman recently brought an older book of his, The Immortals, back into print. Different from his usual fantasy stories, this book is about future U.S. internment camps for victims of a new strain of an AIDS-like virus. He says that the new version is altered from the original. "In my original manuscript and first publication there was quite a bit of swearing in it. I used the 'f-bomb' in that book on a couple of occasions; the only time in my writing career that I ever knowingly did that. My justification at the time was that 'real people in the real world' would speak that way. Later, when I had a chance to republish the book, I went back and removed all the 'f-bombs.' On a second reading I found that it got in the way of the message for me. While people 'in the real world' may not guard their speech so carefully, the book isn't about the 'real world.' The important thing is the story and the message, not the verisimilitude of the whole thing."
Hickman then pointed this out, "Being emotionally inarticulate doesn't get you anywhere. There's a difference between letting people know THAT you feel and letting them know HOW or WHAT you feel."
Im still of the opinion that a well-placed, sunnuva bitch can carry a lot of weight. Much more than a, darn it. Its shocking to put a swear word in the mouth of a character who rarely swears. Some of the more creative epithets can add a lot to a story. Like adverbs, passive voice, or any part of language, swearing is a tool. If you use it properly, it can add a lot to your story. If you don't, it shows as glaring overkill.
You can't please everyone, however. If you use swearing, you'll turn off those who don't like it. And if you don't use swearing, someone may notice and question the "realism" of your story.
When I read in A Novel in a Year that the author believes swearing in fiction usually betrays an immaturity in the writer, quite honestly the first word that crossed my mind was Bullshit. I think a well-chosen shit for brains or fuckhead or cock breath can really lift a sentence to giddy heights of illicit pleasure. And the big reason why I am mounting a defence of the swear word is that its just the way a lot of people talk. If there wasnt any swearing in my manuscript, Id actually think it failed the test of the real.
It is strange that people don't write swear words. Even in films, even the ones 'not for kids' swearing seems to be cut out of it sometimes, when you know in certain situations the charicter would have reveled in a 'FUCK OFF'. It always strikes me as a bit odd when characters don't swear when you know clearly they would.
Then again I grew up in Australia where the word fuck is used in place of so many different adjectives. swearing is common place and part of everyday language. It's not said (generally) in a mean or derogatory way, its just how I talk, espescially among friends or people I know quite well. Now living in the UK I have toned down so much, I've had to. I got warnings at the first two jobs I had here for swearing to much, if my computer annoys me I will sit there and yell and swear at it!
it's always funny when english workmates over hear my conversations to my Mum and sit there looking agahst when I swear whilst talking to her. Then they all give me dirty looks and say 'I can't believe you use the 'f-word' when you talk to your mum!'
a problematic facet of the question of how much to swear, in writing, is the eloquence (or lack thereof) of the characters themselves. i agree with Hickman that overuse of teh swears is a crutch for those without anything articulate to say--but when you're writing an inarticulate character, it makes sense to have that character swear a lot.
I have regularly been around people who swear in the Mike Tyson style - every third word is "fucking" this or "motherfucker" that, or I don't know what. Many of them teens. I don't really know who people think they're protecting from swearing. It's out there all the time.
It does kind of make me sad. Swearing is not punctuation. It's emphasis. It's for showing real, strong emotion. (Lately I'm guilty of a bit more punctuation-type swearing than I'd like.)
I'm in this boat as well . I say fuck way too much . I tell people around me not to be offended , cause I really don't mean it the way they think I might . It's a bad habit I picked up years ago at my first job , which was me being surrounded by guys who cussed non-stop & a job that would make the Pope curse a blue streak if he had to deal with the crap we did . I keep trying to calm my language down some what , but it is not easy .
I just wish people would stop cursing in podcasts so indiscriminately, not because I give a fuck [shit damn ass] but because I like to listen to them at work, and I can't wear headphones there. The "explicit" and "clean" tags on iTunes are not used nearly widely enough, and boy do I hate surprises like that. "It doesn't say 'Explicit', and it's about video games, so how much cursing could there be?" Quite a bit, it turns out!
Swearing in writing is, and should entirely be, character driven. The writer's opinions on swearing should not influence that. Scott Sigler's work is based in the real world. People swear in the real world. Hence, there's swearing in Scott's work. For example, one of his characters in Nocturnal has Tourette's Syndrome. One of the symptoms of Tourettes is Coprolalia. To try and write that character without swearing is ridiculous. It makes the character un-real. Another character is a police detective. They swear and have very black humor. To write it any other way is disingenuous and, in my opinion, preaching against swearing. I tend to stop reading preachy books.
Now, Mr. Hickman writes primarily fantasy novels. When you generate an entire world all your own, you can remove swearing all you want. I'd be amazed at a world where no epithets are used, but I've already accepted the unreality of that world anyway. It's all good. However, I do disagree with the changes he made to The Immortals. I recently listened to his Podiobook version and find that a sprinkling of swearing in those situations would have been a better, stronger choice. I still enjoyed it, but it would have had a bit more realism to the characters.
Keith said:
I just wish people would stop cursing in podcasts so indiscriminately, not because I give a fuck [shit damn ass] but because I like to listen to them at work, and I can't wear headphones there. The "explicit" and "clean" tags on iTunes are not used nearly widely enough, and boy do I hate surprises like that. "It doesn't say 'Explicit', and it's about video games, so how much cursing could there be?" Quite a bit, it turns out!
This is why I made sure our podcast has the "explicit" tag on itunes. Dick jokes are always funny in a video game podcast, but they might not be appropriate for all situations.
I remember seeing some comedian and after about 15 minutes he pointed out that he had made us laugh without using an swear words. He launched into some self-righteous speech about it but was quickly interrupted by a heckler yelling "SHUT THE FUCK" and was met with more laughter than anything said by the comedian.
That's not necessarily true. In fact, it's pretty uncommon among people with Tourette syndrome. It's a stereotype of Tourette based on extreme cases, a spotlight fallacy, if you will.
To be honest I love the power of being able to throw swear words around. I come across as an over achiever and relatively feminine so throwing a few "fucking cunt face" words in there balances the whole package out. Also, I'm in a male dominated sphere and by being able to out curse them I get props or they leave me alone. The down side of this whole deal is I feel my speech is starting to suffer due to the constant use of the word "fuck".
jon_o_b said:
It is strange that people don't write swear words. Even in films, even the ones 'not for kids' swearing seems to be cut out of it sometimes, when you know in certain situations the charicter would have reveled in a 'FUCK OFF'. It always strikes me as a bit odd when characters don't swear when you know clearly they would.
Then again I grew up in Australia where the word fuck is used in place of so many different adjectives. swearing is common place and part of everyday language. It's not said (generally) in a mean or derogatory way, its just how I talk, espescially among friends or people I know quite well. Now living in the UK I have toned down so much, I've had to. I got warnings at the first two jobs I had here for swearing to much, if my computer annoys me I will sit there and yell and swear at it!
it's always funny when english workmates over hear my conversations to my Mum and sit there looking agahst when I swear whilst talking to her. Then they all give me dirty looks and say 'I can't believe you use the 'f-word' when you talk to your mum!'
I currently live in Australia and have done so all my life and I would never ever EVER swear in conversations with my Mum! I don't doubt that you did, but I certainly don't think it's a reflection of Australian culture, except that we are more liberal generally so it's likely that some families are far less concerned with swearing than others. But isn't that like anywhere?
In Australia, I don't know of any families who believe it's perfectly fine to say "fuck" to strangers on a first meeting, though. I have also been told by an Australian friend that she would like my music better if I didn't swear - I used "fuck" once in a 6 minute song and it's the only song with a swear word in it. (I write industrial and prog rock/metal music, for context - fans as a general rule don't object to swear words, but I like playing with words so I only use swear words if it's vital to what I want to get across.)
I agree that the word "fuck" is used in place of many different adjectives in Australia but it's still not something that's thrown around in public except inadvertently as part of overhearing another's conversation or as a way to shock, or of course if you find something out that's awful or are in pain!
As a matter of course, and I think this is just common courtesy, in Australia if you're talking to someone you don't know, or a boss, or in school to a teacher, or another formal environment, it is not considered appropriate or acceptable to swear and people don't do it. I'm a lawyer and have often interviewed construction workers to get evidence for my litigation matters and yes, they'll occasionally slip in a swear word, but they apologise immediately and don't think it's "OK". I mean, I'm not offended so I don't care whether they swear or not, but it's tantamount to the cultural view that swearing isn't something you do as a matter of course. I do appreciate the view that swear words can get in the way of vocabulary and are often a sign of laziness.
Personal view? Expletives used when in high stress or when utterly relaxed and just "in that mood" = awesome. Personally, I love it. I swear a fair bit when talking to friends (I quite enjoy saying "cunt" just because it feels like a great word) and I feel similarly to Mur when she says she loved the shock-value aspect of "Heathers" calls, etc.
I also take the middle ground in my reading matter, wanting the swear word to be a tool and not used "just because". But it's certainly not going to turn me off a piece of work, and I think it's ridiculous to suggest either swearing or no swearing fails to represent reality - it all depends on the characters and the situation as to whether swearing is part of that reality.
heeheee, any sentence with a well-placed "cock breath" in it will have me laughing.
Men named Tracy who write fantasy and are memebers of Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, that freaks me out
mightymur
NEWSWIRE
I'm lost
JAN 29, 2009 10:36 AM