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6/1/05
5/31/05

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Kay_

Kay_

Boston, MA
February 2003

MAY 31, 2005 04:32 PM

What happened to for better and for worse?

If I was so worried that my future spouse was going to cheat on me that I felt I needed to write up a contract, I wouldn't bother marrying him.

And who would base a marriage on such shallow things as weight gain? If your partner's extreme weight gain...or loss for that matter, made them less attractive you, then maybe you should talk it out with them and try to encourage a healthier diet. I should hope that you would love a person for a hell of a lot more than the way they look. A relationship based on something so shallow isn't going to last anyway.

unravled

unravled

Vancouver, WA
August 2003

MAY 31, 2005 04:41 PM

Keith said:

Look. Everywhere in the world divorce rates are climbing. Something isn't working. Marriage is outdated and/or broken. Maybe a contractual relationship is something modern people can understand better than the "TEH invisible boogeyman in TEH sky gon' dun smite you if you fuck up." If this fixes marriage for some people, so be it.




I think working relationships require respect above all else. I respect my partner enough not to cheat on him, lie to him, or abuse his trust in any way. I think that is what's missing from a lot of modern relationships, not a fear of God.

I don't think asking your future spouse to sign something that says he'll be fined if he lies, cheats, or gains weight is either the solution to the problem, or respectful of him or the relationship.

Ophelia

Ophelia

SUICIDEGIRL

Illinois, USA

MAY 31, 2005 04:45 PM

I read a post by some woman today who said that she'd had it written into her and her husband's prenup that they were to remain childfree.

As much as the romantic in me wants to say, "no, love will always prevail!" I've seen far too many people break up because one expected to change the other's mind over the child question at some point in the marriage. Discussing weight pre-marriage, however, seems a little silly.

Helter

Helter

Chester, PA
OLD SKOOL

MAY 31, 2005 04:49 PM

Ophelia said:
I read a post by some woman today who said that she'd had it written into her and her husband's prenup that they were to remain childfree.

As much as the romantic in me wants to say, "no, love will always prevail!" I've seen far too many people break up because one expected to change the other's mind over the child question at some point in the marriage. Discussing weight pre-marriage, however, seems a little silly.



I tend to agree, but divoce is expensive... If you know going in that the weight issue will be a dealbreaker, it makes sense to get it down in the beginning.

waldo

waldo

I'm lost
June 2004

MAY 31, 2005 04:52 PM

This is about the primacy of money.

That is, that money should be the driving force and deciding factor in all relations.

puke puke puke puke

faithless000

faithless000

Chicago, IL
May 2003

MAY 31, 2005 05:11 PM

waldo said:
This is about the primacy of money.

That is, that money should be the driving force and deciding factor in all relations.

puke puke puke puke



marriage has always been contractual, and has always been about money.

relations are rather seperate. if you don't need a contract to be sure that your lover will always be your lover, then getting married is irrelevant. it's icing on the cake.

Helter

Helter

Chester, PA
OLD SKOOL

MAY 31, 2005 05:22 PM

sunburntkamel said:

waldo said:
This is about the primacy of money.

That is, that money should be the driving force and deciding factor in all relations.

puke puke puke puke



marriage has always been contractual, and has always been about money.

relations are rather seperate. if you don't need a contract to be sure that your lover will always be your lover, then getting married is irrelevant. it's icing on the cake.



maybe irrelevant to your love, but not neccesarily to the continuation of property ownership in the case that one of you dies.

Liante

Liante

SUICIDEGIRL

Kiribati

MAY 31, 2005 06:00 PM

Assuming that these contracts are fairly and freely negotiated between two parties with equal bargaining power, I don't see a problem with them. It's just a realistic communication about what they expect and what they value, even if those values and expectations aren't the ones that some of us might choose to emphasize. The contracts should be amendable by mutual consent of the parties later on, but that's about the only reservation I have.

I'm not sure how realistic it is to expect prospective spouses to have the equal bargaining power needed to make that kind of contract fair, though. Real relationships are rarely so neat.

Clidna

Clidna

Emo, ON
January 2005

MAY 31, 2005 06:40 PM

Keith said:

unravled said:

Keith said:


Aye. As a married man myself, I can tell you quite confidently that love is just a prerequisite, along with patience, diplomacy, respect, stubborn-ness (I'm not giving up on this marriage, damnit), and a sense of humor, along with a million other crucial things. Like money.



And I completely agree that it requires all those things. What it doesn't require, for me, is a contract.



Look. Everywhere in the world divorce rates are climbing. Something isn't working. Marriage is outdated and/or broken. Maybe a contractual relationship is something modern people can understand better than the "TEH invisible boogeyman in TEH sky gon' dun smite you if you fuck up." If this fixes marriage for some people, so be it.



I think the reason divorce rates are climbing is because marriage is no longer the sacred vow that it once was. Back in the day, couples stuck together through thick and thin, or "for better or for worse". Now many can't be bothered to work on their relationships, because they see nitwits like Britney Spears get married for 2 days, or Elizabeth Taylor (how many is she up to? 12 marriages? 14?)
People are under the assumption that falling in love is the hard part, and after marriage it's all easy, when in reality, falling in love is the easy part, and keeping the relationship together through thick and thin takes work!

faithless000

faithless000

Chicago, IL
May 2003

MAY 31, 2005 07:02 PM

Helter said:

maybe irrelevant to your love, but not neccesarily to the continuation of property ownership in the case that one of you dies.



that's rather my point. it's a means of securing your financial future. there's no point in being sentimental about "marriage shouldn't need a contract." marriage is necessarily institutional and contractual.

Brinstar

Brinstar

Chicago, IL
September 2002

MAY 31, 2005 07:10 PM

Keith said:

unravled said:

Keith said:


Aye. As a married man myself, I can tell you quite confidently that love is just a prerequisite, along with patience, diplomacy, respect, stubborn-ness (I'm not giving up on this marriage, damnit), and a sense of humor, along with a million other crucial things. Like money.



And I completely agree that it requires all those things. What it doesn't require, for me, is a contract.



Look. Everywhere in the world divorce rates are climbing. Something isn't working. Marriage is outdated and/or broken. Maybe a contractual relationship is something modern people can understand better than the "TEH invisible boogeyman in TEH sky gon' dun smite you if you fuck up." If this fixes marriage for some people, so be it.



I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that a lot of failed marraiges were failed from day one. Sure, there are things they *could* have done to try to make it work, but they probably approached marraige with the wrong attitudes and very likely should never have gotten married to begin with. I'm not a fan of divorce at all and I'm not saying people should just go "damn I screwed up, divorce time!" but I really don't see the divorce rate dropping until people start approaching marraige more realistically from the start.

thorr74

thorr74

Sylvan Lake, AB
December 2004

MAY 31, 2005 07:14 PM

I don't know about the fattness one, but the adultary one sounds good to me, and I actually thought about that when my parents got divorced.
WHY should the cheating, spouse get anything for leaving?
Divorce rates are so high, just say I owned a house, my fiance moved in while dating, we marry, she fucks my best friend, she leaves me.....why should she get half my home???????
(this goes for cheating guys too)

Motionboy

Motionboy

Saint Helena
January 2004

MAY 31, 2005 07:54 PM

unravled said:

Aquaman said:
mine will say "no fatties" biggrin



You're a prize, I bet.



of course i am
kiss


it was a jk btw dont get all pissed , i do care about my partners personality much more then their physique.

joshuaheretic

joshuaheretic

Urbana, IL
December 2004

MAY 31, 2005 09:10 PM

There isn't anything wrong with forming contracts about your expectations in a relationship. The problem arises when you tack this on to the institution of marriage and expect to get a tradtional marriage out of it.

"I will love and cherish you forever in the bonds of holy matrimony, till death do us part. Oh, and if you get fat I'm out of here like a shot."

It just doesn't work. I think that marriage should be replaced with a flexible system of social contracts. Then, if three people want to live together so they can regularly have sex with each other, it makes sense to consider a stipulation that they all remain within certain specifications of hotness. If two people want to share a condo, it makes sense to stipulate a certain number of years and have certain requirements about what happens if you move out. And if you want to stay with another person forever because you love them, that's the contract you get.

That said, they have a perfect right to do things this way.

[Edited on May 31, 2005 11:10PM]

Jeff_Fries

Jeff_Fries

Humptulips, WA
September 2003

MAY 31, 2005 10:08 PM

Koenigsegg said:
i don't want to be ethnically insensitive, but what in the hell are japanese people eating that is making them fat


Carbs, hello.

sakita

sakita

Sweden
February 2003

JUN 01, 2005 01:32 AM

SqueakyShoes said:

demetrius_z said:
What happens if the husband goes on a massive diet? Wait, I don't need to say anything after what. the. hell. surreal



How about "How The Hell"? How the hell do you enforce something like that? Daily weigh-ins?




My question was more like... What if the woman gets pregnant? Pregnant women tend to gain weight.. maybe not 20 kilos..but still.. if she weighed close to her husband's weight, and then gained weight with the pregnancy...oops she weighs as much as her hubby.

somnambulant

somnambulant

Canada
June 2004

JUN 01, 2005 01:50 AM

Yet another reason why the idea marriage has become so far from what it *should* be about.

/me adds to the list.

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