video games > your mom

im constantly surprised by how otherwise perfectly sane and intelligent people seem to write off the potential of this medium. it really just blows my mind.

i was actually watching forrest gump last night on television, and i felt a little sad when both his mother and wife passed away. now i didnt get all misty or anything, but it was sad. but honestly... i was moved much more when aeris died in ff7. as cool as all the technical ish going on with the new star wars movies, i was even more amazed when that freak from metal gear was able to read my mind.

now, granted, these moments are few and far between, but video games are still young. im sure many people here can still remember when frogger & pole position were introduced into their local pizza parlor. look how far we’ve come in just a couple decades. i’m so freaking jealous of what our grandchildren will get for entertainment. and i’m so freakin tired of people who have never completed a video game telling me that this medium will never be as accepted or as highly regarded as cinema and television (tv?!?! really?!?!) and various other forms of ‘mainstream adult’ entertainment.

am i *really* the only person out there that thinks in the future, when technology is finally catching up to our imaginations, that video games will eclipse movies and television to become the most effective way of experiencing any given scene or situation?

haha aeris' death was totally wrecked for me because i simply didn't believe it, i spend the entire game thinking they'd find some way to bring her back with all the life force talk going around and stuff.
i just couldn't believe they'd kill a main character like that untill the end credits rolled and i was just like...aeris is really dead?!

but yeah i always had great faith in videogames, to me it's a medium that blends many artforms into a single whole that can move people as much as any other medium.
motion, sound, atmosphere, storytelling, a good game has it all.
ofcourse it's usually something like GTA that sells mainly on being vulgar and simple that claims succes rather than something truly artfull like beyond good and evil but that's besides the point. (apparantly that ugly painting of dogs playing cards is more popular than most classical art as well)

I agree in a way. I know some games that would have been better movies though. IE Metal Gear Solid 3 Snake Eater on PS2. The gameplay sucks (I think) and the game has tons of really good and involved FMV. Really most games I get tired of watching all these damn videos. Especially in games that aren't story oriented. FF7 was very story oriented and involving and it makes you get more wrapped up with the charecters and makes it more emotional when they get killed....

Don't dis on GTA. GTA 3 and Vice City were great games. Extremely deep with many little "minigames" and many different storylines to follow. Sure, it was violent and sexual and had bad language, but that was just to establish atmosphere, just like in movies.....

i know and GTA has a great entertainment value but when you actually get down to it the gameplay is hardly poetry in motion, just very entertaining.

I guess I just like being entertained. Shooting people, putting out fires, driving ambulances, stealing cars, jumping cars, running from cops, looking for hidden secrets.....Fun stuff. I play video games for fun I guess.

yeah look at the sales for Ico or the first (err 4th?) prince of persia. its sad how the truly evolutionary games are being ignored for some mindless violence and t&a. mortal kombat outsold virtua fighter 4? wtf are you people thinking?!?!

but while i dont really care for gta, i think its doing an alright job of displaying a fully living and breathing society. thats a good example on how technology needs to step up before we really reap the benefits. i swear if i have one more person shoot me through a wall im snapping the disc.

The game play and graphics were crude even in SA, but when CJ and Sweet were in the car before CJ went to kill smoke, I got a litte choked up. Guess I just respect puttin in work for your hood. Busters.

i'm still kinda curious if any of you expect video games to mature into a viable medium for expression, to the point where people will be left angry/sad/awestruck like they do with modern movies. mgs3 was basically a movie (lots of cut scenes, little gameplay), but even with insane talent and deep pockets it wasn't able to mess with any of my emotions more than the average daytime drama. what is it that has yet to fall into place?

I agree with you, I think games will get there. The reason they aren't yet is that I think they lack a certain element of humanity. Also, they aren't necessarily contrived to tweak the emotions, the way a film is. Yes there are story lines but game developers have to always be conscious of the fact that gamers want action before story. At least for the most part, I think that's the perception.

in that way, games have a lot in common with the "comic book" (although comics have the 'maus' and 'watchmen' and 'sandman' and 'a conversation with god' etc). when i first heard the notion of game = art, i was sort of like "..no.... no..." then i realized that was really snobbish, and there are incredible design, plotting, music, animation, voice etc elements that go into it. frankly, i'm willilng to buy the "game" as a legitimate medium.

although, i think it needs to learn to spread its conventions - i'm not sure that the standard sword & sandals fantasy or scifi shooter is really going to cut it. and that will be the ongoing problem i think - how do you provide a cathartic experience of fun entertainment (after all it is a *game*) while balancing deeper artistic themes and character developments? i think the shallowness of quests & shooting is at odds with these other elements.

similarly, how do you develop a 3d, layered protaginist - when "you" are that protaginist (my understading is that the "player" in most RPGs is purposefully bland b/c the notion is that you will project yourself more easily onto that figure then), and your interaction with the "game world" is inherently limited (by the choices of the programmer, by the nature of interface & controller etc). those kind of limits are not insurmountable, but they do seem to be dominant & they do so be really big obstructions to more sophisticated storytelling.... it's possible, and it will be interesting to see how those are overcome. i sure don't know/see an obvious way (then again.. i'm not really creative...).

yeah good post. i'm curious to see what kind of controller nintendo comes up with for their next console. everything i've read so far on the supposed 'revolution' sounds pretty nifty, but it will be interesting just how far they are willing to stray from the standard dual shock controller. seems to me anything they could possibly come up with might alienate 3rd party developers from being able to port their games to a system with a, again, 'revolutionary' (but probably funky ass) controller. the whole touch screen thing on the DS just isn't enough for me, feels like more of a gimmick.

as for the story telling and the shooting being at odds, i think there's a few FPS that have amazingly deep yet intuitive control, and there's some that have a surprisingly in depth storyline. someone just needs to combine the two without having it feel forced (cough deuce ex cough) basically the next step seems to be greater player immersion. its too bad half life 2 turned out to be so much like... half like 1. i really need something to come out that warrants my interest, all i seem to play anymore is sfa3.

i think the most exciting genre for me is rpgs. theres just so much that they could do with them. even adding basic rpg elements seems to add a great deal of depth to what may otherwise be a rather basic game (castlevania sotn). although, after the 4 year wait for that disappointing 'fable' game, im losing hope fast. zelda better be damn good...

oh well. i don't really have any ideas on what could improve them either. so... back to street fighter.

i agree with the supposed 'action before story'. i think a lot of games actually would be ruined with a more in depth story line. if i was playing devil may cry and was forced to sit there for 30 minutes worth of a cut scene all momentum would be lost and i doubt the game would be as fun. but cmon, has anyone played that series? amazing action, tepid story. but if they were to spend a little more time on the script, or maybe just aim for a more sadistic b-movie approach, the game as a whole could really benefit. i think the high cost of producing games is holding the industry back. no one seems to want to take chances anymore with high profile games, they just do what last years best seller did but they make their game prettier. im really losing interest in that approach.

Woah! Samus is a chick! Sweeeet!

Aeris' death was nothing compared to the tragic demise of General Leo. General Leo's spirit will always live on in our hearts.


¡VIVA EL GENERAL LEO!

bald bull > sally field, apparently.

Dude, I cannot believe that after I went to sleep you brought this argument to the boards on SG. Jesus Christ.


And, I still think videogames are fucking stupid.

FUCK! SPOILER TAGS?? COME ON!!

I mean, I'm still working on FF5 for fuck's sake!

and you should resurrect this thread. jeff would be happy.

yay! ignorance!

when Delitas sister died in fftactics was devistating, also.

nicely put.

edited to say i think i just reached nerd critical mass.

[Edited on Feb 27, 2005 by katiebarthedoor]

I totally got choked up at the end of Grim Fandango when Manny and Meche pulled away on the Number Nine and left Glottis behind. I'm usually sad after a lot of adventure games (e.g., Longest Journey, Syberia), because you really can get attached to the characters.

I think adventure games in general have been some of the most redeeming games in terms of story and character development. Unfortunately, they'll never be as popular as the GTAs of the gaming world (that's not a knock on GTA ... I love 'em all)/

MGS really pushed the limit of the action/story ratio. I loved that game and got totally sucked in by the story despite the shortcomings in gameplay. MGS2, on the other hand, went way overboard and killed what should have been a great game.

I agree on the industry not wanting to take risks. There is so much money involved nowadays that the bottom-line is $$$s instead of inovation. Every now and then a gem appears out of nowhere with a really exciting, fresh idea, but its getting less and less frequent.

*sniff* I'll never forget you Leo

I sure hope they do. One of my favorite things about video games is how immersed you can become in them. I all to often have a short attention span when it comes to games, but I love a game that can suck me in with a great story or characters to the point where the world falls away. The first game i remember really doing this for me was Marathon, and then later with much greater success Half life. The first time i played it i remember being completely engrossed and even scared at quite a few points. I felt as if i was part of the story.

so to answer, I think yes the mediums will bleed together and hopefully move in a direction once thought of as Virtual Reality. Obviously there will always be sucky games or just games with very low production values, but I do think that there will be some amazing experiences to be had, much like reading a good book or seeing a good movie.

ps8 4 teh win!!



oh i forgot about bad mojo!!! soo fun!

[Edited on Feb 27, 2005 by FunkTion]

playing silent hill in the dark by myself with full surround sound was way scarier than any movie I've ever seen.