NEWS: To Prius or Not To Prius?

CULTURE: To Prius or Not To Prius?

I had an argument, or rather got shouted at by a “friend” of mine about the futility of signing a petition that goes to Toyota’s North American President Shigeru Hayakawa, asking him to support an increase in federal fuel economy standards to 35 miles per gallon by the year 2020.

I learned on the National Resources Defense Council website that although Toyota was ahead of the curve when it launched the Prius hybrid, they have a contradictory plan for America on fuel economy regulations.

This guy I know said, “Don’t waste your time with petitions. Toyota makes a Prius because it sells. They are not environmentalists. It’s naïve to think so. Their job is business, not saving the world.” And I assume his subtext is “duh.”

Yeah, I realize Toyota’s first goal is to make money. I never said that the Toyota company was full of bleeding hearts who slam their fists at board meetings and say, “Even if I lose my job and we completely shut down production, if we can just sell one Prius – it will be worth it.”

But I did blindly assume that any car company that pioneers a hybrid probably supports other standards that are green and progressive. I was wrong. I didn't realize that Toyota was part of the lobbying group The Alliance of Automobile Manufacturers who are speaking out against fuel economy standards. The NRDC asks:

This gave me pause. But what can I do now, this moment? Withhold sex from Mr. Hayakawa? Egg his house? Name a voodoo doll after him and stick pins in it’s butt? I can sign a petition. I’m realize that he’s not going to sit down after a long day at work, put his slippers on, read my form letter and gently weep. I can’t make Mr. Hayakawa’s heart grow twice it’s size.

The optimist in me thinks that just in some (sorry, don’t kill me) “cosmic” sense if we all spoke truth to power it's more active than just being cynical. And when we speak up at least the power knows that the people are paying attention. If millions of people, including potential or current Prius owners told Toyota’s North American President that they oppose his policy and would not support his company – they stand to lose money, no? Wouldn't that grab their attention?

I'm not adding my name to a petition in an attempt to save the world with my signature. I’m saying that as a possible consumer, I’m re-thinking supporting the company that doesn’t quite walk the green walk. And when I sign a petition I feel half-stupid and half-hopeful, what if everyone did this? Could we make a difference? And what’s the harm done in taking 60 seconds to try to make a difference?

Don't buy a Toyota? Petitions are for politicians, send one to them. Even if Toyota aren't making them, they want to be able to sell cars with lower mph if people want to buy them. You don't have to agree with that to see how it makes sense for them.

a difficult decision....
get the car to go green yourself and help the environment and support a company that doesnt support greenness at its foundation
or
dont get the car and continue hurting the environment to show you wont stand for a company that only pretends to care on the surface.


maybe i should just get the car cuz its cute....
yeah that sounds like a better way to make a decison.

The Prius is an awful car that does terrible things for the environment.

Care to elaborate or provide facts? Or do you just have a mental disorder that forces you to make baseless accusations?

I thought he was being sarcastic.
Of course, the Prius does do bad things to the environment - it just does them less than other cars.

I ride bikes and sign petitions.

Is it better to live a mile from work and drive a huge truck or live 50 miles from work and drive a Prius?

hurm.

i wanted a prius next.

Can you live a mile from work and ride a bike? Or do you need the truck to haul stuff?

> support an increase in federal fuel economy standards to
> 35 miles per gallon by the year 2020.

Hm. My FJR-1300 rarely gets below 42mpg, and it's a 1300cc sport-touring model. I got over 57mpg going from Orlando to Daytona and back for Biketoberfest a couple weeks ago.

My SV-650 gets more, but the FJR has a convenient MPG display on the dash.

STFU with your cars. You aren't REALLY green.

And yes, I get groceries and everything with it. My two motorcycles are my only transportation, and I have a daily commute of about 45 miles round-trip.

Sounded like trolling to me. But hey, I could be wrong...

Let's see how well that works somewhere that get's snow 3-4 months out of the year.

Nobody gives a shit about petitions.

The Prius isn't as green as it claims to begin with, the 55mph was recorded in laboratory conditions on a rolling road which doesnt acount for a host of variables like aerodynamic drag.
There are a raft of smaller diesel engine cars that will do 50mpg, even my Dad's Mondeo diesel will do 50mpg on the motorway, if you really want a green car, buy a smaller lighter car. or don't buy a car at all. Gordon Murray in a piece in evo mag said that 26 tons of waste are produced extracting the raw materials, then 1.5 tons of solid waste and 74 million cubic litres of polluted air in the build process. the lighter the car the less energy to make, so a two engined automatic carrying batteries isn't very energy efficient there.
Plus it does look like a ZX81 drawing of a slug

This.

Otherwise, I'd be buying a motorcycle ASAP.

I live a mile from work and mostly walk or ride a bike but I use the truck to haul my motorcycle to the track. Besides that It mostly sits in my driveway.

It's frustrating that here in America people still think a Prius is the ultimate green car, while in Europe you can buy amazing diesels (which now burn as cleanly as gasoline engines) that routinely get a true 60 MPG and more:

http://greendepot.org/default.php?page=vehicles

What's more, all those cars are designed to run on bio-diesel.

Maybe you should write your Congressman to ask why these cars that kick the Prius' ass on fuel economy aren't available in the U.S.

Since our country is just a bigger place in general, commutes are generally longer for everybody. We use more gas, so the oil companies get rich and fat. And to keep their status quo, they own whatever is for sale, including car companies and legislators. It's no surprise things are the way they are, but then, unless you also have a shitload of money to throw at the problem, there's not much to be done. Sign a petition if you like, it doesn't take any effort, but it also won't have any effect whatsoever.

Maybe Toyota doesn't want a 35 MPG standard so that they can let the free market decide when their competition is still making gass guzzlers with lower MPG while Toyota continues to making faster more fuel efficient cars??? Maybe there's some method to the madness here?

Thank you. This information mattered to me.
Good job.

Its all about weight, gas diesel, hydrogen, electricity, still takes energy to haul it around and you still have to make it and put energy in it, that pesky little spoiler from the creator of the universe called the 1st law of thermodynamics.
Having gone the Vegan route, I've found vegetable protein is a good source of gas including methane and hydrogen. Not sure what foods produce diesel [maybe McDonald's]or electricity yet tho. I'll report back as soon as I find sources.
I fear the hybrid is simply another South Park target for derision. That episode did prove that my 14 year old has developed the same sick deflicted sense of humor I have.

Christ, some of the responses in this thread are ignorant.

Toyota spent a shit ton of money to build the Prius, which sells for about $24,000 - not big-margin stuff.
They got this money by selling a gazillion cheap little cars and another gazillion larger, higher margin cars and trucks that are less green but have a higher profit margin. Why would any smart company voluntarily push for sweeping rules that would undercut their profit margin and make their engineering job much harder across their entire product line?

For you UK folks, remember that 1 Imperial gallon = 1.2 US gallons, so reduce all those UK MPG numbers by 17% to get vaguely comparable numbers, keeping in mind that the US government MPG test is different from the European MPG standard. The figures are really only comparable within region (I.E. euro Prius mileage figures should be compared with other vehicles tested with the same procedure, otherwise you're comparing apples and elephants).

You want to make a difference that Toyota will notice? Buy a Prius instead of a Toyota Highlander. Toyota has been adding shifts to the Prius plant to keep up with demand and dropping shifts in plants that make vehicles with declining sales numbers. Petitions to Toyota really won't change anything, try writing to your elected representatives instead.

Also, many of those tiny diesel euro cars fail our safety and/or emissions tests, especially the tougher California standards that have also been adopted by NJ, NY, PA and other states. Congress cannot make these cars available here, that's absurd - they would have to revoke the California emissions standards, something they simply can't do.

FWIW, I commute on my motorcycle every day in the northeast, rain or shine until it gets below 40 degrees. Last year, that meant I was only taking the train in January and February so it is more doable than some might think.

That makes sense. It really does fall to the consumer to make more available what they "really" want...