TOPICS:
OCT 18, 2007 09:55 PM
OCT 18, 2007 10:17 PM
OlafTheTroll said:
JunkyardAngel said:
OlafTheTroll said:
I'd like to dress up as a second wave feminist for Halloween, but I'm still working out some kinks in my costume.
A SEXY second-wave feminist?
Well, I won't be wearing a bra, if that's what you mean.
A braless troll.
OCT 19, 2007 03:45 AM
Bitch_PhD said:
Um, the point isn't that "women shouldn't dress like whores." Nor is it that women *should* dress like whores.
Sexy Norman Bates' mother?
OCT 19, 2007 07:59 AM
JunkyardAngel said:
apesamongus said:
But you thrust the catch 22 on them. If you flaunt what you've got, you're pathetic and overcompensating for lack of self esteem. But you'd say the same thing (that they lack confidence) if they tried to fade into the background. Basically, I guess if you're fat, you're fucked.
Yes, That is precisely on the nose what I said. Exactly. You are brilliant. And I never even added a bit to disclaim that asinine statement.
And before you go apeshitamong us, that is not to say that fat, overweight, less-than-gorgeous or any other person is automatically worthless.
Er. Except for that. 
Absolutely nothing prevents you from putting contradictory statements in your posts.
OCT 20, 2007 01:21 PM
OCT 21, 2007 05:31 PM
OCT 21, 2007 11:25 PM
please stand by... we are experiencing technical difficulties with the quotes within the replies... they keep trying to credit the wrong people with the wrong posts... we hope to have this fixed as soon as possible... thank you for your patience 
OCT 21, 2007 11:41 PM
OCT 21, 2007 11:47 PM
LexyLou said:
I agree completely. Why is it that Halloween means sexy time for any female, what we aren't trained in society enough to dress and act like whores? Halloween has equaled traditional sex roles for a long time and in the last 15 or so years beome an excuse to look like a fucking hooker. I mean nakedness is okay, after all look at what site we are discussing this, but I mean if you wear that crap, have the body to do so. The girls that mostly always go for the "sexy" whatever costume are ususally very self concious low self-esteem, girls with a bit too much chunk to be wearing it. That's probably what's so scary about it, the flab hanging out everywhere.
Clidna said:
I wonder why they would have low self-esteem?
JunkyardAngel said:
Maybe they don't do anything, achieve anything or accomplish anything to build it.
apesamongus said:
Man, that flew over your head like a rocket.
JunkyardAngel said:
No, actually, it didn't. I was making a point. A point that is all to easily ignored in today's society. You do not "get" self esteem: you EARN it. ( I assume (hope) that was Clidna's point, too. . .)
apesamongus said:
No, her point was that LexyLou insults girls for having low self esteem and then turns around in the same breath and insults them for being fat and ugly. It's a bullshit standard to hold anyone to.
JunkyardAngel said:
Hahahahahahah. Yeah. Expecting girls--or boys, for that matter--to have a little pride and not dress inappropiately to their body form is a real blow to self esteem. Like it is not already a symptom. . .?
Sure, perhaps they have low self esteem and that is WHY they do not care or take pride in how they present themselves, but avoiding the fact that the "presentation" is not so good is NOT gonna help them.
Addressing the problem of low self esteem simply by telling a person they are good, or pretty or whatever....is pointless and does nothing to help anyone: self esteem does not come from praise and uplifting words, it comes from DOING something of worth, being a person of worth--the ability to be proud of who you are. How you present yourself is a reflection of that.
And before you go apeshitamong us, that is not to say that fat, overweight, less-than-gorgeous or any other person is automatically worthless.
Blahblah blah. Be a sheep. I don't care.
And then, finally, after a lot of posting and reposting and editing, I said:
Actually, self esteem is developed, not earned. And my point was exactly what apesamongus said. Believe it or not, there is an extremely large number of women and men who contribute to society, are volunteers for less fortunate, are great parents, employees, relatives, friends, are wonderful people in general, who still feel bad about themselves because of their size. Why? Because for some reason, assholes got it into their heads that it was ok to make derogatory comments about someone based on something as shallow as physical appearence... they are the ones missing something - they have no compassion, no empathy... and often no self-esteem themselves.
BTW, I'm going to choose to believe that the sheep comment was in reference to his Hallowe'en costume, because the alternative is pretty lame.
OCT 22, 2007 02:00 AM
As far as sexy costumes go, my guess is that these choices are generally tilted towards the gentrification of the psyche (the fantasy of the wearer to become someone or something else, perhaps in this case, sexy, desirable, naughty, etc. - in other words, an adult). Making children's costumes sexier or gender specific isn't necessarily a conscious decision, but that doesn't make it ok. They tend to reinforce a negative self-image through the idea that one must dress a certain way in order to be... What? Cute was it? 
Thankfully, children who have aren't shy about exploring their budding brainier, feminist side have also been given options never before available:
OCT 23, 2007 05:15 PM
Spoiled said:
Formus said:
I had a roommate from Brazil first semester Freshman year. And when Halloween rolled around, he turned to me and asked, "Why do all the women dress like whores?" True story. The answer is: they like to be fucked in the ass by big men who make them feel sheltered and protected.
guiiilllllltttyyyyyyyy..
+1
OCT 23, 2007 06:02 PM
so i went through and read every single reply. the sexy kid costumes are creepie. i htought so when i was the manager at a spirit halloween store a couple years ago. i still think so.
so i've seen people dressed up in what was basically JUST lingerie to go to a halloween party and i thought that was kinda stupid. and the cheap sexy costumes out of crappy material that all look alike and that no one ever bothers to change up a bit and make their own, those bother me.
in the past i put together my own sexy catholic schoolgirl costume with real clothes from arrdvarks n whatnot, did my hair up in pigtails n walked around sucking on one of those unicorn suckers n teased the bloody hell out of every man at that party. i had a blast! this year i'm prolly gonna be some sort of demon or maybe satan's cheerleadeer...WITH BOOBS! why? cuz i have them and i like showing them off! what's wrong with showing off the boobs! and ya know, this particular costume will most likely be stuff from my closet that i don't normally wear and my batwings that i love so much and wish i could wear all year long cuz i love them...so whatever it is,..it's gonna involve batwings n BOOBS!!!
OCT 24, 2007 04:19 PM
Clidna said:
LexyLou said:
I agree completely. Why is it that Halloween means sexy time for any female, what we aren't trained in society enough to dress and act like whores? Halloween has equaled traditional sex roles for a long time and in the last 15 or so years beome an excuse to look like a fucking hooker. I mean nakedness is okay, after all look at what site we are discussing this, but I mean if you wear that crap, have the body to do so. The girls that mostly always go for the "sexy" whatever costume are ususally very self concious low self-esteem, girls with a bit too much chunk to be wearing it. That's probably what's so scary about it, the flab hanging out everywhere.
Clidna said:
I wonder why they would have low self-esteem?
JunkyardAngel said:
Maybe they don't do anything, achieve anything or accomplish anything to build it.
apesamongus said:
Man, that flew over your head like a rocket.
JunkyardAngel said:
No, actually, it didn't. I was making a point. A point that is all to easily ignored in today's society. You do not "get" self esteem: you EARN it. ( I assume (hope) that was Clidna's point, too. . .)
apesamongus said:
No, her point was that LexyLou insults girls for having low self esteem and then turns around in the same breath and insults them for being fat and ugly. It's a bullshit standard to hold anyone to.
JunkyardAngel said:
Hahahahahahah. Yeah. Expecting girls--or boys, for that matter--to have a little pride and not dress inappropiately to their body form is a real blow to self esteem. Like it is not already a symptom. . .?
Sure, perhaps they have low self esteem and that is WHY they do not care or take pride in how they present themselves, but avoiding the fact that the "presentation" is not so good is NOT gonna help them.
Addressing the problem of low self esteem simply by telling a person they are good, or pretty or whatever....is pointless and does nothing to help anyone: self esteem does not come from praise and uplifting words, it comes from DOING something of worth, being a person of worth--the ability to be proud of who you are. How you present yourself is a reflection of that.
And before you go apeshitamong us, that is not to say that fat, overweight, less-than-gorgeous or any other person is automatically worthless.
Blahblah blah. Be a sheep. I don't care.
And then, finally, after a lot of posting and reposting and editing, I said:
Actually, self esteem is developed, not earned. And my point was exactly what apesamongus said. Believe it or not, there is an extremely large number of women and men who contribute to society, are volunteers for less fortunate, are great parents, employees, relatives, friends, are wonderful people in general, who still feel bad about themselves because of their size. Why? Because for some reason, assholes got it into their heads that it was ok to make derogatory comments about someone based on something as shallow as physical appearence... they are the ones missing something - they have no compassion, no empathy... and often no self-esteem themselves.
BTW, I'm going to choose to believe that the sheep comment was in reference to his Hallowe'en costume, because the alternative is pretty lame.
I am only quoting all of that because Clidna went to such trouble to make it come out looking so organized.
My point was addressed to hugely fat people wearing skimpy clothing, letting it all hang out, no matter how bad they look.
1) Earning and developing self esteem are pretty much the same thing
in my book. In other words, you don't just "get self esteem" because people tell you you are smart or nice, or pretty (whether or not you are any of those things).
2) OF COURSE people who are good are good and shuld not be judges solely on their appearance.
NO ONE should be judges solely on their appearance.
However, people ARE judged on their appearance (see any hot guys or gals lately?? put on make up or cute clothes lately?)--and people who do not care how they are judged looks-wise are generally showing symptoms of low self esteem.
Looks are a biological draw for mating purposes.
Large people can take just as good care of themselves as small folks. They can dress to fit their body type and so on.
Note that the larger models on this site generally pose how they can to make them "look their best"? Just another example of my point. You do not see a whole lot of gigantic, flabby womenfolk in SG sets.
Thank you for replying politley.
Seriously.
Please ignore my typos.
OCT 24, 2007 04:43 PM
JunkyardAngel said:
I am only quoting all of that because Clidna went to such trouble to make it come out looking so organized.
Pfft. Fuck Clidna AND the horse she rode in on. (Totally fucking joking, Clidna)
Pfft. Write. You're type O's are the reeson I'm typing too you.
I see your points regarding larger models who pose a certain way to diminish the look of rolls or whatever, but I think it's for a different reason than you noted. I think it's because the majority of members here either prefer or at least expect thinner models. Again, I "think" - I'm sure there will be a shitload of people responding with "nuh uh...not me!" or whatever.
Anyway, I agree with you that people are judged by their looks - but the criteria for what is attractive varies from person to person.
This is what caught my attention:
My point was addressed to hugely fat people wearing skimpy clothing, letting it all hang out, no matter how bad they look.
Several years ago, I would have totally agreed with you. Now, I realize that when/if I think that...I'm just a shallow asshole who is deciding for everyone else what their standards of beauty should be.
I am not the barometer for what beauty is and neither are you. No one is...no matter how much they believe they are. We have our own inner opinion of what that is but it really isn't necessary to inflict that on others.
I would never want someone to feel bad because I wasn't attracted to them...and I spewed mean-spirited things because of it.
I don't think you're that kind of person at all.....I just wanted to put a different perspective on things. That's all. 
OCT 24, 2007 06:59 PM
TheGringo said:
I see your points regarding larger models who pose a certain way to diminish the look of rolls or whatever, but I think it's for a different reason than you noted. I think it's because the majority of members here either prefer or at least expect thinner models. Again, I "think" - I'm sure there will be a shitload of people responding with "nuh uh...not me!" or whatever.
Hmmm. It would be intersting to hear from some of them on that. I would bet that they just want to look really good--standard version?
Anyone out there able to comment on this (a less-than-skinny SG (or a photographer), that is)?
TheGringo said:
This is what caught my attention:
My point was addressed to hugely fat people wearing skimpy clothing, letting it all hang out, no matter how bad they look.
Several years ago, I would have totally agreed with you. Now, I realize that when/if I think that...I'm just a shallow asshole who is deciding for everyone else what their standards of beauty should be.
Very sly way to say I am a shallow person! Ha ha ha ha!
I will have to think about that some more. I am not sure that I agree, and I am not sure that my not agreeing makes me shallow. . .?
For example, one of my volunteers is very large (at least 125 pounds overweight). She is wonderful and I appreciate her no end for her compassion and hard work. But if she were to show up in a shorty shirt and hip hugger pants with her gut all hanging out I would still be shocked, I would think she looked awful and I would wonder what the hell she was thinking. Would I *say* anything? NO. (Unless it was inappropriate for working with our rescue and with the *public.*) I would not say anything because 1) I would not want to hurt her feelings, 2) It's not my busniess 3) I like and repsect her.
Does it make me shallow that in the example above I thought she looked awful? (My opinion.) Or would it matter more that I didn't say anything ebcause I like and respect her? (My actions.)
TheGringo said:
I don't think you're that kind of person at all.....I just wanted to put a different perspective on things. That's all.
I don't either; though I have to admit that I do judge people on how they present themselves.
Another example of this would be: Let's say I had a volunteer show up for a meeting/'training day dressed in fancy clothes that she did not want to ruin. I would assume that she was not very serious about wanting to volunteer and that she was a bit on the ditzy side, because she knew she was coming to clean cages at an out door animal shelter.
Am I just going in cricles now?
I kneed a spelchekor for mi fingerz.
OCT 24, 2007 07:36 PM
JunkyardAngel said:
Does it make me shallow that in the example above I thought she looked awful? (My opinion.) Or would it matter more that I didn't say anything ebcause I like and respect her? (My actions.)
I don't think it makes someone shallow if they find someone unattractive.
I think it makes you shallow if you think less of that person or you treat them shitty because you find them unattractive.
OCT 24, 2007 10:14 PM
TheGringo said:
[SPOILER]
Like those shitty, shallow muthafuckers who laugh at me for wearing cowboy boots with Speedos.
Boris Yeltsin is Speedo-man!
OCT 24, 2007 10:18 PM
JunkyardAngel said:
Boris Yeltsin is Speedo-man!
What?!? No cowboy boots or feather boa to go with it?
No fashion sense at all.
freshprncebelair
Ellicott City, MD
June 2004
OCT 18, 2007 08:42 PM