NEWS: Meet the Douchebag!

really? i thought the part about being "lined up outside the bar" (seachelles) meant that they knew what they were getting into before they started drinking...guess i was wrong. they must've left out the lecture about alcohol impairing your judgement before you drink it at my medical school. sorry, carry on with your righteous indignation.

sorry, double posted for some reason.

show me your bewbs and make me a millionaire , best buisness plan ever!

Uh. OK. As I said above: "one cannot always say the same for GGW." Now, they might not have taught you how to read for comprehension at your medical school, but at my law school they did.

The point is (once again for the slow folks out there), at GGW it's not always like that. Sometimes it's sober, of age girls wanting to do it. In those cases, have a blast. However, sometimes it's just random already drunk girls they find on the street. Or underage girls. Again, we know this because Francis finds himself in these legal predicaments almost constantly.

Righteous indignation indeed.

Can you seriously not see the difference between what Girls Gone Wild and SuicideGirls?

"reading comprehension, slow folks," biting commentary, i'm hurt. really. you're right on the point that they SOMETIMES ask women who are drunk and as such can't give consent and enter into a legal contract. more importantly, their judgement is clouded and they make a decision that they may later regret. however, i highlighted sometimes because of the relatively few times he's been in trouble compared to the number of women who have been in his videos. my point is that people treat this guy like he's the devil incarnate when it seems like most of the time his videos contain consenting adults looking for attention/fame/exhibitionist thrills.

so, he's the biggest douche bag in the world because "one cannot always say" that women are sober when they decide to take their clothes off in front of the camera? did i comprehend that well enough for you? if i decide to drive after i'm already drunk, is it not my own responsibility still? this guy has made himself rich by exploiting people in a tasteless manner, but not in a way that's really all that different from reality tv.

And what, from your extensive osteopathic experience, makes you think this ratio is in any way related to his culpability as a slimebag? "Relatively?" Are you fucking serious? You do realize that rape victims are also often hesitant to report the crime, don't you? . . . what's the difference with this? "Gee, I'd rather not make a "federal case" ('cause that's where it will probably end up - federal court) out of this, because if I do in two weeks it'll be all over the news/web and my parents/friends/coworkers/boss/priest/Korean lady at the corner store will find out."

Yes. He is. As Jimmy Stewart said, "there are rules about that sort of thing." Taking advantage is taking advantage.

Have you failed to even bother to consider the number of women who might be subsequently ashamed after such activity after a night of rolls and booze, and who therefore might not want to make a fuss per above? Calm down, "doc."

Bulllshit bullshit bullshit. Reality TV: people contracting, for some sort of compensation, to take part in something they know will expose/reveal them to the general public. Douchebaggery: approaching people who are succeptible to being exploited and doing just that.

Better bone up on your malpractice insurance boyo. It always blows my mind that the consesus remains that lawyers are the scumbags of the professional world when there are jewels like you floating around.

hahahahahahahahahahaha, that was good. really. assume much? you made several about me and they were all wrong. are you really able to extrapolate that much about my personality from a few posts i've made on one article? i disagreed with subrosa on one thing but i would never assume that he was an unethical lawyer or he was what was wrong with the professional world because of it, i actually figure he might be a pretty decent guy. i also don't understand why would you think i was an osteopath? that's not a bad thing, osteopaths and allopaths get essentially the same education.

jewels like me? how do you know that i don't volunteer at a homeless shelter or do charity work? you certainly were able to deduce quite a bit from very little. regardless, i never said that he wasn't a douche, i implied he wasn't the greatest douche ever.

btw, i thought squire made some very good points, esp about how difficult it might be for some of the women to come forward. its a shame it was buried in with all that vitriolic nonsense.

Ok. You were the one who started it with your sarcastic "I'm going to medical school so you should listen to me!!!!" nonsense. I don't give a shit if you're hurt or not. Don't try and whip your post-graduate educational dick out on someone if you don't know what they're packing themselves.

This is the entire point I was trying to make. Thanks for conceding.

Thanks again.

Gee, it seems to me that he deals with this stuff all the time. That doesn't seem seldom to me. It may to you. And if so, then you and I have widely different interpretations of the word "few".

That, in fact, wasn't your point. The point you made above was that GGW was cool because chicks were lined up in front of that bar that Seychelles went to. If you were trying to make a different point, then you failed spectacularly. Spend less time puffing yourself up for getting into medical school and being snarky at people who weren't being snarky to begin with and spend more time actually making the argument you're allegedly trying to make.

No, actually. That's not what I said. I said he was a douchebag. And yes, a big part of that was because one cannot always say that women are sober when they decide to get naked. But a bigGER part of that is because that's clearly part of his business plan.

You may be going to "medical school", but you are horrible at making analogies. Please stop. Leave it to people who understand the difference between individual initiative and being coerced or exploited while incapacitated.

Apparently, "relevance" is not on the curriculum at your very impressive "medical school", either. Thanks for playing.

I love people who start off trying to be snarky and indignant and then get all huffy when people fire back at them. Makes me all giggly inside.

I'm amazed this thread is still around, personally.

-TM

at what point did i say that ggw was cool? you're right, i did fire off the sarcasm first but, i never said it was cool. that's an assumption you made. again, what i was saying was that he may be a douch but i don't know if biggest douche ever is the case. as far as him constantly dealing with legal issues, i was under the impression that it was because individual cases persisted for long periods of time not because there was a large number of them. when i said 'relatively' i was comparing the number of times he's gotten in trouble with the number of women who seem to have appeared in his videos. if i'm wrong, please let me know and show me source that demonstrates how many cases he has against him. with that i'm curious, not sarcastic.

squire was right that some may be too ashamed to come forward after the event due to the attention that surrounds this guy, that must be horrible for them. my original point was never that there is nothing wrong with what ggw does or that this guy isn't a douche. i don't own any ggw videos, don't think that they're cool as you said and i do believe that its possible to see that he is a douche even if all you do is listen to him talk for 30 seconds. however, my question is at what point do you consider personal responsibility in the matter? i'm sure someone is going to jump on that and say that i'm saying blame the victim. i'm not, i'm just saying that even drunk people have a certain amount of responsibility for their own behavior. that is not a poor analogy.

huffy? how is that huffy? i was conceding that he made good points but i thought that parts of his argument were fluff. if i had said whatever, and never come back to read this thread that would have been huffy.

p.s. i don't know if people really want to continue watching only 3 people argue on an open thread. so if subrosa or squire want to email me, that's fine. if its not worth your time, that's fine, too.

No, by all means continue. Watching your sleazeball-coddling get torn to shreds is the kind of fun that restores my faith in humanity.

where do you get that i was coddling him? i said he is a douche, just not necessarily the greatest ever and i asked what personal responsibility people might have, that's all.

Incorrect. You went from this:

-to this:

-to this:

-to this:

-and in all that tripe, the closest you got to actual condemnation of Francis was saying once that he "may be a douche" - and that after scorn and chastisement. You defended and defended and defended Francis to death, and for your efforts your points were torn into nice little bite-sized pieces. This pleases me, and I await its continuance.

Dude, that's not what you were saying. Go back and read it. You started off defending him. You then conceded that yes, he does some bad things, but he's mostly on the up and up. Now it's "yeah, he's a douche." That's why you're getting called out for backpedalling.

You're partially right in that some of these cases last a long time. For example, the one that attn_ho linked to was initiated in 2003. It should be noted that those charges (which he plead no contest to) came from the testimony of seven different women. Then there was another case where he used someone's likeness without permission. Another suit was brought, and then dropped (in all fairness, because he had video of the girls giving permission. The girls argued initially that they were intoxicated at the time, but then agreed to drop the suit.)

But even then, it fails to list the probably hundreds of times when he has gotten away with this kind of shit because the girls either didn't care, didn't know, or didn't want to bother with going through the demands of pressing charges. Gringo cited one such potential case here. I'm sure if you do a little more searching on your own, you'll find plenty.

Not to mention his awesomely aggressive and misogynistic behavior in 2006 to an LA Times Reporter. Basically, the guy is fucking scum.

With something like this, there's always a measure of personal responsibility. Of course, just a measure of it doesn't necessarily trump the fact that this guy has built an empire on getting girls drunk, getting them to take their shirts off and then selling it to people. Sure, the girls may have been willing on some level (or on all levels in some cases), but that doesn't divorce responsibility from Francis as well. It's a balance thing. It may be that the vast majority of the time the lion's share of the responsibility for the decision to get naked falls on the women involved. But there is plenty of evidence of plenty of cases where it is not. If Francis were a decent human being, he wouldn't choose to profit off of those legally incapacitated folks. But he isn't a decent human being, so he does.

It's an awful analogy for the reason I said above. If you chose to drive while drunk, it is your own individual decision. If you're drunk and some guy does everything he can to get you to take your top off for a camera, you're being goaded to do something while you're in a vulnerable position. The two situations aren't remotely comparable.

If we were to accept your analogy, we'd have to accept it for situations where guys get girls drunk and then date rape them. If you still can't see the difference between choosing to drive drunk and being convinced to do something that you wouldn't do if you weren't drunk, then there's nothing more I can do for you.

If this has been covered, I apologize...but I'm just curious what people think of Guys Gone Wild.

-TM

Francis took video of Spitzer's Whore when she was 17. Her lawyers allege Francis knew this at the time of filming.

Just sayin'.

whoa, its like six degrees of EWWWW in that link,