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DhD_No_Pants

DhD_No_Pants

Katy, TX
May 2006

AUG 15, 2007 05:49 PM

Stiles said:
DhD, I'm under the impression that the vast majority of cases like this involve dads who don't pay, rather than moms who disappear.

Also, since most Americans do not have a passport and they only renew every 10 years this would seem to affect a small percentage of people at most.



Yeah I get that. Like I said, I don't even know why/how I got worked up about it, other than over the past week I've been dealing with some very aggravating child support issues so my dander is already up about it.

Just take my rants and stick them on a shelf labeled 'Overly sensitive, aggravated with dealing with a state entity, hormonally challenged lady going off about something stupid"

bok

IDGAS

IDGAS

Jackson Heights, NY
March 2004

AUG 15, 2007 07:41 PM

I was once involved with a woman, we broke up, we restarted dating after a year or so, and after a few weeks of dating she said btw you are a daddy.

I started paying for the baby, we moved in together, I am paying for everything, after sometime we breakup again, now I am not allowed to see the kid, I keep paying, I take the mom to court.

After the DNA test... I am not the dad frown - I really loved the kid frown frown - she was the sweetest little girl frown frown , it turns out the mom was cheating on me with another guy (who she was married to, and her was also giving the mom money while she was living with me.

The lessons learned
I liked being a daddy,
I was a good dad,
get DNA tests sooner,
it is only money, and
doing the right thing from the start is always right.

And the sweetest little girl who I loved with all of my heart turned into a manipulative little lier like her mother - I used to keep in contact with the dad. He got fucked over by the mother too and was stopped from seeing the little one after a few years.

Jasper

Jasper

SUICIDEGIRL

I'm lost

AUG 15, 2007 08:18 PM

I don't see how being allowed to have a passport and paying your child support are relative. And often a passport is needed for work, or identification reasons. If its about a vacation, you don't need to go out of the country for that. Fuck it, blow the cash in Vegas. Disneyland. There's plenty of places right here in the country you can spend your money. Generally people applying for passports are people who need them for good reason.

I think this is pretty ridiculous. Like I said, the two aren't related to each other. While we're at it, lets deny passports to people who are late on their rent/utilities/car payments or phone bills.
How about if you haven't payed back your student loans, you can't get a passport.

It's the same idea, is it not?

Lockeblade

Lockeblade

Australia
May 2007

AUG 15, 2007 09:07 PM

Jasper said:
It's the same idea, is it not?



Same idea, different circumstances. Children are not rent/utilities/cars/phones. And people keep mentioning needing to leave the country for work... What? The pay-rate is that much better in Mexico? Or do you mean those people who have a job that pays for them to jetset all over the world... chances are, if they have that kind of job they can pay their child support so...

Jasper

Jasper

SUICIDEGIRL

I'm lost

AUG 15, 2007 09:54 PM

Imagician said:

Jasper said:
It's the same idea, is it not?



Same idea, different circumstances. Children are not rent/utilities/cars/phones. And people keep mentioning needing to leave the country for work... What? The pay-rate is that much better in Mexico? Or do you mean those people who have a job that pays for them to jetset all over the world... chances are, if they have that kind of job they can pay their child support so...



I'll say it again:
sometimes passports are used as identification reasons. it's not just the travel aspect of it.
more than once I've applied for a job where they've asked for a passport as a form of identification because its basically all of a persons info in one thing, and makes it easier for paperwork purposes. it seems the passport is becoming more in demand in the states now, for uses outside of luxurious travel. or maybe I'm just hallucinating. or maybe I just live in a really strange town.

and if we're talking about jobs that jetset their employess, then
lets also talk about the kind of people that have the money to leave the country in the first place. If you're getting a passport for the purpose of travel ("vacation"), I'm assuming this person has some money. This person probably also pays their child support in the first place. Soo whats the point of having this limitation if it's not even targeting the right people?

Because it seems to me like they're trying to target deadbeat dads who have amazing amounts of secret money to go off to Europe. And I'm just not buyin' it.

I'm aware children are not rent/utilities/cars/phones. But unless I'm mistaken, childSUPPORT is yet another form of payment. a bill, if I may be blunt and heartless. But no matter who you're NOT paying, you're stiffing someone who deserves the money. May that person be the landlord or a lovechild, well I guess that all depends on priorities.

latenite2007

latenite2007

USA
May 2007

AUG 16, 2007 06:39 AM

they also can keep you from getting a hunting,fishing,and motorcycle licence.

latenite2007

latenite2007

USA
May 2007

AUG 16, 2007 06:42 AM

Its like they have a deadbeat daddys list

latenite2007

latenite2007

USA
May 2007

AUG 16, 2007 06:48 AM

the 8% goes to the state or the friend of the court

punk

punk

Phoenix, AZ
January 2004

AUG 16, 2007 06:57 AM

I'm not sure how many deadbeat parents (I say parents because the father could have custody and the mother pays child support) this will net, but I'll wager that somewhere, the person who came up with this had the idea that this might net some of the big deadbeats - the sort that owe tens of thousands of dollars and decide to disappear to another country in order to avoid Johnny Law.

The rule might be a little more effective, though, if it nullified your passport entirely. I don't think there's a "national passport database," so I can't imagine that sort of thing would be easy to check.

Like reprobate said, this probably won't do a whole lot. It would be more effective to put up wanted posters at the customs check points. whatever

Holden_Caulfield

Holden_Caulfield

Ann Arbor, MI
April 2004

AUG 17, 2007 09:59 PM

reprobate said:
Wow. Just wow.

For all the bad press that deadbeat dads get in this country, y'all sure got their backs. Here's a news flash, this law only applies to parents in arrears that have been reported to and investigated by the state who are then certified by the federal government and need a new or renewal passport. About the rarest of fucking circumstances but hey, let's all worry about how "unfair" that might be to daddy.


Thanks for clarifying this. I really appreciate it. smile

Holden_Caulfield

Holden_Caulfield

Ann Arbor, MI
April 2004

AUG 17, 2007 10:08 PM

reprobate said:

DhD_PillowPants said:
The only things I see posted here are actually fairly legitimate questions, I don't see anyone really 'reaching' for explanations.

I beg to differ. No one here is standing up for the kinds of these poor misunderstood fathers.

Pretty much all I am saying is that just like the majority of laws and rules in this country, some people end up getting screwed by the system.



No, most of them are screwed for being stupid. Don't contest paternity in court if someone you were fucking ends up with a kid. That's stupid. Do the test yourself and pay the $800. It takes a month and then you'll know. Don't fuck people and disappear so completely that you can fail to notice that you have a child for five years. I can't be the only one who runs into my ex at the grocery store. Don't say, well, I don't have a court order, so I'm not paying shit for two years until the divorce is final. That's stupid.

This is really simple, basic, grown up stuff. If you spilt up and you have kids, you look at the tables and figure out what you owe, and you pay by check. You don't wait for a final custody and support order, or a filiation order, or for the state to get involved. Do those two simple things and you will avoid 99.9% of these problems, because the reason there are state collection arms and penalties for arrearages is that kids need to fucking eat, even if there's no court order, and having to set up a bureaucracy and involve the courts in every little detail is an incredibly expensive waste of resources.


Oh how I wish "imputation of income" could be put in tabular form. There is no formula for imputation or income. There is a Friend of the Court who generally despises you for being a non-custodial parent. Appealable, yes, but after only how much damage has already been done by them by their lawyers (commonly known as referees). Let's hope the judge is reasonable, because appealing him or her will take some time and money.

I almost wish that child support offenses were criminal in nature--at least then I might be afforded an attorney. I've done well acting as my own attorney, but when you're dealing with the might of the county prosecutor's office representing the custodial parent gratis, somehow I think that I've been dealt a bad hand in an unfair game of life. There really should be more parity in the system, don't you think?


Clidna

Clidna

Canada
January 2005

AUG 17, 2007 10:24 PM

Jasper said:
I'll say it again:
sometimes passports are used as identification reasons. it's not just the travel aspect of it.
more than once I've applied for a job where they've asked for a passport as a form of identification because its basically all of a persons info in one thing, and makes it easier for paperwork purposes. it seems the passport is becoming more in demand in the states now, for uses outside of luxurious travel. or maybe I'm just hallucinating. or maybe I just live in a really strange town.



I think you must live in a really strange town... I've never met anyone who forks out $$ for a passport just for identification purposes, when there are a whole lot of other pieces that can be used that are free. I work for a bank, so I ask for ID at least 10 times a day, and I see a passport used as ID maybe 2 or 3 times a month (and that's being generous).

Of course, I'm assuming that you have to pay for your passport in the US, like you do here in Canada.

In Canada, BTW, if you are not paying your child support, they take your driver's license. You want to talk about affecting ability to work?

reprobate

reprobate

New Orleans, LA
December 2002

AUG 17, 2007 11:26 PM

Jasper said:

Imagician said:

Jasper said:
It's the same idea, is it not?



Same idea, different circumstances. Children are not rent/utilities/cars/phones. And people keep mentioning needing to leave the country for work... What? The pay-rate is that much better in Mexico? Or do you mean those people who have a job that pays for them to jetset all over the world... chances are, if they have that kind of job they can pay their child support so...



I'll say it again:
sometimes passports are used as identification reasons. it's not just the travel aspect of it.
more than once I've applied for a job where they've asked for a passport as a form of identification because its basically all of a persons info in one thing, and makes it easier for paperwork purposes. it seems the passport is becoming more in demand in the states now, for uses outside of luxurious travel. or maybe I'm just hallucinating. or maybe I just live in a really strange town.

and if we're talking about jobs that jetset their employess, then
lets also talk about the kind of people that have the money to leave the country in the first place. If you're getting a passport for the purpose of travel ("vacation"), I'm assuming this person has some money. This person probably also pays their child support in the first place. Soo whats the point of having this limitation if it's not even targeting the right people?

Because it seems to me like they're trying to target deadbeat dads who have amazing amounts of secret money to go off to Europe. And I'm just not buyin' it.

I'm aware children are not rent/utilities/cars/phones. But unless I'm mistaken, childSUPPORT is yet another form of payment. a bill, if I may be blunt and heartless. But no matter who you're NOT paying, you're stiffing someone who deserves the money. May that person be the landlord or a lovechild, well I guess that all depends on priorities.



No one asks for passports for identification purposes. They may be an option, but they are never required, and frankly, you're eighteen, how many jobs can you have had, anyway? Further, whether you "buy it" or not, the whole purpose of the article is that the program is startlingly effective. Perhaps you should read it. Finally, no one goes on welfare, or hungry if you don't pay your cable bill. Why child support is different isn't that hard to grasp.

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