courtneyriot said:
I'm with lil_tuffy on this.
You can't tell me what he did is ground breaking or even subversive! I like Banksy. But there is nothing impressive about what he did with the Moss prints.
Their is one thing that is impressive/noteworthy. The amount of money the prints sold for and how quickly they sold.
The Yes Men (of which I am a huge fan) are anti-corporate and anti-globalization. Banksy is more anti-pop culture. I find it a thin straw to grab at to label Bichlbaum, Bonanno, and the like avant garde. An even weaker straw to claim the Banksy's "work" is a modernized (?) version of what the Yes Men were/are doing.
courtneyriot said:
I'm with lil_tuffy on this.
You can't tell me what he did is ground breaking or even subversive! I like Banksy. But there is nothing impressive about what he did with the Moss prints.
Their is one thing that is impressive/noteworthy. The amount of money the prints sold for and how quickly they sold.
The Yes Men (of which I am a huge fan) are anti-corporate and anti-globalization. Banksy is more anti-pop culture. I find it a thin straw to grab at to label Bichlbaum, Bonanno, and the like avant garde. An even weaker straw to claim the Banksy's "work" is a modernized (?) version of what the Yes Men were/are doing.
At this point, I'd say Banksy is just straight-up pop culture.
courtneyriot said:
I'm with lil_tuffy on this.
You can't tell me what he did is ground breaking or even subversive! I like Banksy. But there is nothing impressive about what he did with the Moss prints.
Their is one thing that is impressive/noteworthy. The amount of money the prints sold for and how quickly they sold.
The Yes Men (of which I am a huge fan) are anti-corporate and anti-globalization. Banksy is more anti-pop culture. I find it a thin straw to grab at to label Bichlbaum, Bonanno, and the like avant garde. An even weaker straw to claim the Banksy's "work" is a modernized (?) version of what the Yes Men were/are doing.
At this point, I'd say Banksy is just straight-up pop culture.
You may be right, but that doesn't change the intonation of his previous "works." Or even this current one.
Hell, Che Guevara is practically pop culture now. That doesn't negate his status as a revolutionary. (This is a poor example, I know. Just go with me on it.)
turin said:
considering he's an "art terrorist" or whatever, I'd guess that getting paid 50k was the entire artistic point, rather than the painting itself.
turin said:
considering he's an "art terrorist" or whatever, I'd guess that getting paid 50k was the entire artistic point, rather than the painting itself.
Yeah, the "artistic" point...
I'm pretty sure thousands of starving artists around the world have been racking their brains trying to think of a way to make a respectable artistic statement out of cynically cashing in. fucking brilliant, if you ask me!
Andy Warhol addressed the way people become numb to a specific trope when pounded over the head with it in a repetitive manner. Marilyn wasn't his first such piece. He compiled hundreds of serigraphs of appropriated imagery to further drive home the fact that the more a person sees of one thing, the less it means to them (I don't know about you, but if I were to type or read a word thirty times on end, it would pretty much lose all meaning to me.), and the less it works as a signifier of its original meaning. This is kind of ironic when you take into account the fact that Marilyn's is among the most appropriated styles in all of modern art/pop culture.
Kate Moss was recently hailed most influential celebrity in the world. By using her face repetitively, Banksy seeks to undermine her celebrity, turning her into a mere image. One without connotation.
When I saw what Banksy had done, my initial reaction was "Whatever. I've seen that before." Then, I thought about it for a second and it clicked: Banksy appropriated Warhol not to deaden our reaction to Kate Moss' image—though he succeeds there—but to intensify Warhol's message at a point where it had almost fallen into itself.
Dunno if that means everything I intended. Ask for clarification if you want. I'm bad at making other people understand the way I think... which is poorly.
moMNtum said:
Andy Warhol addressed the way people become numb to a specific trope when pounded over the head with it in a repetitive manner. Marilyn wasn't his first such piece. He compiled hundreds of serigraphs of appropriated imagery to further drive home the fact that the more a person sees of one thing, the less it means to them (I don't know about you, but if I were to type or read a word thirty times on end, it would pretty much lose all meaning to me.), and the less it works as a signifier of its original meaning. This is kind of ironic when you take into account the fact that Marilyn's is among the most appropriated styles in all of modern art/pop culture.
Kate Moss was recently hailed most influential celebrity in the world. By using her face repetitively, Banksy seeks to undermine her celebrity, turning her into a mere image. One without connotation.
When I saw what Banksy had done, my initial reaction was "Whatever. I've seen that before." Then, I thought about it for a second and it clicked: Banksy appropriated Warhol not to deaden our reaction to Kate Moss' image—though he succeeds there—but to intensify Warhol's message at a point where it had almost fallen into itself.
Dunno if that means everything I intended. Ask for clarification if you want. I'm bad at making other people understand the way I think... which is poorly.
Also, sorry for being an untethered dick.
and to me it just looks like he totally "phoned it in" with some hackneyed parody just to make a few grand. whatevs.
Margot_Dent said:
and to me it just looks like he totally "phoned it in" with some hackneyed parody just to make a few grand. whatevs.
Um... 'kay. That's fine.
Another thing I thought was funny was that Varnavides said "Moss was happy about Banksy using her image in an iconic way," when I view it as 100% iconoclastic. Not just a picture.
Seriously. I think a lot (though not all) of Banksy's work is set up this way, so that most viewers miss the point completely.
Margot_Dent
Los Angeles, CA
February 2004
OCT 25, 2006 02:15 PM