Reject the National ID Card

Read: Reject the National ID Card by Congressman Ron Paul

words don't begin to describe what a bad idea this is.

and while we're at it, let's let osama wipe his ass with the constitution.


wtf?



-pb

um, yeah...

not getting one.

Period.

If they make it mandatory someone please point me in the nearest direction of the mole people, because I would really like to join.

Sorry, but I don't see what the big deal is about a national ID card.

I understand the objections to "..."larger network of screening points" inside the United States." and biometric info. Why is biometric info (fingerprints, eye scans, etc) a problem? Because once your data is stolen, you can't get new biometric data - you only get one set of eyes.

But back to the point -

ID card ≠ "a Soviet-style internal passport system"

Most of us have Driver's Licenses already. Our Social Security Numbers are de facto National ID numbers - why is everyone worked up about streamlining it and reducing the number of fake IDs? (Aside from those of you who are underage... )

I agree with slimjim its not that big of a deal. My insurance company all ready knows about all the speeding tickets in all the states, so all this does is, make it so that I don't have to get a new drivers liscense every time I move.

A national ID card is inevitable. Sooner or later each of us will have one. It will have biometric data. Then you won't even need the card in this new age of technology. Iris and thumb scan machines will be everywhere. From getting your school lunch to getting on an airplane. It will be at your grocery store, public library, and anywhere you shop. It is already happening.

So what's the problem? Politicians are turncoats, killers, liars, thieves... criminals with protection of the law. Can you really trust them with Total Information Awareness? Scientia Est Potentia you know.

while i'm not shitting my pants about it, i do think the idea is pretty stupid and i wouldnt be excited if everyone had to have them.. one day it will happen.

i have credit cards. big brother is already watching.

The name on the card is Winston Smith. The same name as the main character in the book 1984 by George Orwell.

From Popular Science

[Edited on Sep 08, 2004 by amsterdamn]

it is just like the new US Military ID's.... in my opinion, (see that kids OPINION), it isn't a big deal... i think the 1984 talk is blown out of proportion... the only people who have something to really worry about, i think, are criminals... the US government has a lot on their plate.. and they don't have the time or even desire to follow around "joe schmo" just for fun...

i think, from the past, our government is great at reacting AFTER the fact... therefore, i believe, actions will be taken only as necissary... i don't know if i am explaining my point very well...

finally, i think the only people who could benefit from this mass information database, will be advertising... like in Minority Report...

1984 anyone??
christ.
we're already there.

There was a discussion about this on NPR some weeks ago. One of the main criticisms was that the ID card would be used not only for identification, but would be used for collecting information on and tracking things like credit card purchases, library checkout records and such. It's true that this data is already collected by credit card companies (used for things like "fraud protection" and the like), but the main issue is that these databases are not currently centralized. The national ID would change that. (One of the main responses to challenges regarding this is the idea that "only criminals have anything to fear from this.")

This is not the same thing as a Social Security card or a driver's license.

Links: Justice Talking, Ben Merens shows 1 and 2.


[Edited on Sep 08, 2004 by Infra]

I dont like it because I have not committed a crime, nor am I a terrorist, and as such, the US government has no reason to need to collect my biometric info, or know what I have been reading, what I have purchased or where I choose to spend my time.

biometric data... its so they can identify the bodies when nuclear war burns us all to a crisp...

pic0

i dont see what the fuss is all about. i think its a good idea

Here's some of the fuss.

Credit card companies can track our purchases. However, those records are not tied to our library checkouts, travel records (aside from ticket, gas and other purchases made on those cards), etc. We can choose to go with another company, use different cards for different purposes, or use services such as PrivateBuy, eGold or barter. That is not an option with a national ID. (At a minimum, such alternate actions may be flagged -- given the "only criminals need to be worried" attitude.)

Although this system could be used to identify potential criminal behavior, the definition of what is and is not criminal is fluid. Furthermore, in regard to terrorist threat assessment, this database could be used for a form of profiling. This is good in some ways, but holds the potential for abuse. There is a question as to how such a centralized database would eventually be used, and this is of special concern to political activists.

There is the question of what exactly the government needs to know. For example, do they need to know that I subscribe to SG, or that I spend most of my grocery funds on organic food? For a credit card company there may be valid reasons for tracking such data. I'm not sure that the same holds for a government agency.

The risks of having such a database compromised are much higher than those involved in having the information distributed over several different databases, especially considering that biometric information cannot be changed (easily, at least) after identity theft.

There is the question of whether or not we should be able to keep some aspects of our life private, or at least shielded from government scrutiny.

One proposal is that the ID would be necessary for purchasing things including stamps -- the idea being that the stamps themselves would be flagged so that it would be possible to track who sent the letter and to whom.

Basically, I think that the issue comes down to whether or not this system would reflect a proper balance between the rights of the individual and the responsibility of the government to protect its citizens. That debate is not over, hence the fuss.


[Edited on Sep 08, 2004 by Infra]

more reason for me to want to move away. far far away.

I don't buy the "what's all the fuss about?" argument.
Consider this:

"The government will make use of these powers only insofar as they are essential for carrying out vitally necessary measures...The number of cases in which an internal necessity exists for having recourse to such a law is in itself a limited one,"

Congress discussing a National ID card?
Nope.
Hitler addressing the Reichstag in 1933 before the passing of the Enabling Act - legally making the German government a dictatorship.

Oh, yeah, the same thing they've been trying to do with the military for the last 6-7 years. Unsuccesfully, I might add.

i won't be getting one. you can count on it.

i wouldnt have a problem with it if the only time you were required to present one would be when you access government services or something like buying chemicals or something similar. if it would be used all the time, then id have a problem.

That's a stupid idea. You don't need a National ID card as a regular, everyday citizen. I could see if you were going to make felons carry them.....but not everyday citizens.

This topic has come up in the UK as well and I just don't understand what everyone is afraid of? I personally haven't got anything to hide from anyone and all the information which would be contained on a card is already on my passport/driving license etc. What is everyone afraid of?

I lived in Hong Kong for 7 years and carried one there and it wasn't a problem.

Most of you all carry ID that could be used for the same purposes anyway...Driver's Licenses.