She isn't going to be McCains running mate. I belive i saw on one of the news programs they had a GOP stratigist that she said she isn't even trying to go for the vp spot nor would McCain have much to gain by picking her. All this speculation that she is activly campaigning just becouse she went to a dinner party a large group of conservatives run is a bit silly. Also if you watch Bush's War on Frontline you will know that she was kept in the dark on almost every thing that was going on since Rumsfield would never willingly give her information and at one point she had to have her own staff be sent over to spy to get the information she needed. Not saying she is innocent but I do think she gets too much blame for being some one benched most of the time from the start.
abbazappa said:
She isn't going to be McCains running mate. I belive i saw on one of the news programs they had a GOP stratigist that she said she isn't even trying to go for the vp spot nor would McCain have much to gain by picking her. All this speculation that she is activly campaigning just becouse she went to a dinner party a large group of conservatives run is a bit silly. Also if you watch Bush's War on Frontline you will know that she was kept in the dark on almost every thing that was going on since Rumsfield would never willingly give her information and at one point she had to have her own staff be sent over to spy to get the information she needed. Not saying she is innocent but I do think she gets too much blame for being some one benched most of the time from the start.
Yes, she was kept out of things, but that isn't much of an excuse for someone in her position. If she was really and truly bothered by the whole thing, she would have resigned in protest and brought Rumsfeld's plotting out to the rest of us.
The discussions in the White House were top secret and sources say, involve some of the President's most senior and influential advisors, principals of the National Security Council. In dozens of private talks and meetings, sources said that a handful of top advisors discussed specific high-value al Qaeda prisoners and exactly how those prisoners would be interrogated. Whether, for example, they would be slapped, pushed, deprived of sleep or subjected to simulated drowning, called waterboarding. The discussion about the "enhanced interrogation techniques" were so detailed, sources said, the interrogations were almost choreographed, down to the number of times the CIA could use a specific tactic. Former CIA director George Tenet, in an interview last year with ABC News told Charles Gibson,
"It was authorized. It was legal, according to the Attorney General of the United States."
It also was discussed and approved in meetings by the National Security Council's Principals Committee, a group that included Vice President Cheney, Condoleezza Rice, Colin Powell, Donald Rumsfeld, George Tenet, John Ashcroft.
And anyone saying she "was kept out of things" is either ill-informed or drinking the kool-aid. Rumsfeld keeping her in the dark about one matter is not, by any stretch of the imagination, evidence that she was out of the loop on everything.
A year later, amidst the outcry over unrelated abuses of Iraqi prisoners at Abu Ghraib, the controversial 2002 legal memo, which gave formal legal authorization for the CIA interrogation program of the top al Qaeda suspects, leaked to the press. A new senior official in the Justice Department, Jack Goldsmith, withdrew the legal memo -- the Golden Shield -- that authorized the program.
But the CIA had captured a new al Qaeda suspect in Asia. Sources said CIA officials that summer returned to the Principals Committee for approval to continue using certain "enhanced interrogation techniques."
Then-National Security Advisor Rice, sources said, was decisive. Despite growing policy concerns -- shared by Powell -- that the program was harming the image of the United States abroad, sources say she did not back down, telling the CIA: "This is your baby. Go do it."
Condoleezza Rice has plans to head West after her time as secretary of State %u2014 not plans to be vice president.
She stressed Tuesday that she has no aspirations to join John McCain as his running mate on the Republican presidential ticket this fall. McCain, an Arizona senator, has wrapped up the GOP presidential nomination.
"Senator McCain is an extraordinary American, a really outstanding leader and obviously a great patriot," Rice said at a State Department news conference with the foreign ministers of Canada and Mexico. "That said, I am going back to Stanford, back to California, west of the Mississippi. I very much look forward to watching this campaign and voting as a voter."
Condi was just a more user friendly replacement for a black man, with vast military and multi-cultural experience, trying to tell the truth. She too has no public speaking ability nor black traction. She is probably the one for McCain, but I don't think it matters with the SOS the GOP is selling. People know they want change, of any kind. I'm willing to gamble on the audacity, its better than what we've had even if simply because its different.
I know there is going to be a multitude of insults flung my way here in a second, but personally, I'd like to see a McCain-Giulliani ticket- Condi, in most republicans eyes, would be a poor poor choice, but then I believe I am just preaching to the choir at this point ::ducks and covers due to ensuing insult shit-storm::
Rude_Ruca said:
I know there is going to be a multitude of insults flung my way here in a second, but personally, I'd like to see a McCain-Giulliani ticket- Condi, in most republicans eyes, would be a poor poor choice, but then I believe I am just preaching to the choir at this point ::ducks and covers due to ensuing insult shit-storm::
Hooraydiation said:
What's the appeal of Giuliani, exactly? When I asked my friend what she saw in him, she was aghast.
I promptly shut up, feeling I'd said something stupid.
From what I've researched, the appeal is lower crime and the ability to prepare for Kabuki theater at a moments notice. (almost noone is going to get that last bit)
But seriously, if someone's reaction to "why support this candidate" is being aghast and not saying "here's the facts" then that is a bad sign for the candidate.
Subrosa said:
So what's the point? Other than to fend off charges of racism. All she does is tie McCain more directly to the Bush presidency. I don't know if that's a good strategy.
Someone else pointed out in another thread that the GOP leadership basically knows that they're going to lose this election, and that by letting McCain run, they'll be able to shun him from the any prominence in the party for the future. Perhaps they have the same in mind for Condi. Cleaning house of everyone they have a mind to get rid of.
Hooraydiation said:
What's the appeal of Giuliani, exactly? When I asked my friend what she saw in him, she was aghast.
I promptly shut up, feeling I'd said something stupid.
Well, I am probably going to piss you, and well, everyone here off because I don't have like, insta-linked sources, but from conversations I have had with a gentleman that used to work under Giuliani at the Justice department, he's always had a knack for picking good/sound advisers. I heard he has, or had picked, some highly qualified people for his defense staff. I mean, in a republican's eyes, and I am fully aware that on most basic principals we are never going to agree on the issues that in fact set us apart, but yeah, from both a neocon's and pragmatist's standpoint, it'd be a very solid team....
Hooraydiation said:
What's the appeal of Giuliani, exactly? When I asked my friend what she saw in him, she was aghast.
I promptly shut up, feeling I'd said something stupid.
Well, I am probably going to piss you, and well, everyone here off because I don't have like, insta-linked sources, but from conversations I have had with a gentleman that used to work under Giuliani at the Justice department, he's always had a knack for picking good/sound advisers.
Hooraydiation said:
What's the appeal of Giuliani, exactly? When I asked my friend what she saw in him, she was aghast.
I promptly shut up, feeling I'd said something stupid.
Well, I am probably going to piss you, and well, everyone here off because I don't have like, insta-linked sources, but from conversations I have had with a gentleman that used to work under Giuliani at the Justice department, he's always had a knack for picking good/sound advisers.
Don't be irritated, but I've got nothing. This was definitely a frustrating embarrassment for anyone supporting Giulliani. I won't even try to defend that. And seriously, if you can prove my assessment wrong further, I'd like to hear it. Always better to be in formed (already knew about this debacle, though). I am just going on, like I said, the accounts by a pretty reputable person who used to work for him......
Hooraydiation said:
What's the appeal of Giuliani, exactly? When I asked my friend what she saw in him, she was aghast.
I promptly shut up, feeling I'd said something stupid.
Well, I am probably going to piss you, and well, everyone here off because I don't have like, insta-linked sources, but from conversations I have had with a gentleman that used to work under Giuliani at the Justice department, he's always had a knack for picking good/sound advisers.
Don't be irritated, but I've got nothing. This was definitely a frustrating embarrassment for anyone supporting Giulliani. I won't even try to defend that. And seriously, if you can prove my assessment wrong further, I'd like to hear it. Always better to be in formed (already knew about this debacle, though). I am just going on, like I said, the accounts by a pretty reputable person who used to work for him......
In addition there is his ties to suspected boy-diddler Monsignor Alan Placa. He also married his cousin which is, you know, creepy.
Hooraydiation said:
What's the appeal of Giuliani, exactly? When I asked my friend what she saw in him, she was aghast.
I promptly shut up, feeling I'd said something stupid.
Well, I am probably going to piss you, and well, everyone here off because I don't have like, insta-linked sources, but from conversations I have had with a gentleman that used to work under Giuliani at the Justice department, he's always had a knack for picking good/sound advisers.
Don't be irritated, but I've got nothing. This was definitely a frustrating embarrassment for anyone supporting Giulliani. I won't even try to defend that. And seriously, if you can prove my assessment wrong further, I'd like to hear it. Always better to be in formed (already knew about this debacle, though). I am just going on, like I said, the accounts by a pretty reputable person who used to work for him......
In addition there is his ties to suspected boy-diddler Monsignor Alan Placa. He also married his cousin which is, you know, creepy.
I didn't know that last bit. But yes +1 to the creepy factor.
I feel having good advisors is one thing, but if you fail at listening to them again and again and you are ignorant of the diference between Al Qaida and Iranian extremists, you shouldn't be running. I mean, his advisors didn't correct him till the third time, and then he had to be corrected on television by Sen. Lieberman AKA "Loserman", as dubbed by the neocons. So yeah, bad advisors or bad ability. Neither bode well for McCain in my eyes, his flawed politics aside.
Hooraydiation said:
What's the appeal of Giuliani, exactly? When I asked my friend what she saw in him, she was aghast.
I promptly shut up, feeling I'd said something stupid.
Well, I am probably going to piss you, and well, everyone here off because I don't have like, insta-linked sources, but from conversations I have had with a gentleman that used to work under Giuliani at the Justice department, he's always had a knack for picking good/sound advisers.
Don't be irritated, but I've got nothing. This was definitely a frustrating embarrassment for anyone supporting Giulliani. I won't even try to defend that. And seriously, if you can prove my assessment wrong further, I'd like to hear it. Always better to be in formed (already knew about this debacle, though). I am just going on, like I said, the accounts by a pretty reputable person who used to work for him......
In addition there is his ties to suspected boy-diddler Monsignor Alan Placa. He also married his cousin which is, you know, creepy.
I didn't know that last bit. But yes +1 to the creepy factor.
I feel having good advisors is one thing, but if you fail at listening to them again and again and you are ignorant of the diference between Al Qaida and Iranian extremists, you shouldn't be running. I mean, his advisors didn't correct him till the third time, and then he had to be corrected on television by Sen. Lieberman AKA "Loserman", as dubbed by the neocons. So yeah, bad advisors or bad ability. Neither bode well for McCain in my eyes, his flawed politics aside.
Just a heads up: you're talking about McCain, they're talking about Giuliani.
abbazappa
Sacramento, CA
June 2006
APR 10, 2008 11:50 AM