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Virtute

Virtute

Brooklyn, NY
July 2007

AUG 02, 2007 08:57 PM

krncookies said:

JohnHaverchuck said:

FreakPirate said:


Again... what's the gain in covering that up?



It's a colossal embarrassment. Tillman meant a lot to recruiting efforts.



I don't think the government had anything to do with it. His dying words were "Don't shoot! I'm Pat Tillman Goddamnit". I think his team was tired of him and someone got fed up and killed him. its happened before in the Army. They probably thought that he was going to get them killed- and acted to defend themselves.

please dont take this like i am justifying soldiers killing soldiers, I'm just sayin it happens



I said that I think if it was intentional, it's more likely it broke down to a dispute between soldiers. I think the scramble to cover up the huge fuck up came down from on high, but I don't believe the government killed Tillman.

Cockzombie

Cockzombie

Japan
July 2006

AUG 02, 2007 09:12 PM

agreed

reprobate

reprobate

New Orleans, LA
December 2002

AUG 02, 2007 09:12 PM

krncookies said:

JohnHaverchuck said:

FreakPirate said:


Again... what's the gain in covering that up?



It's a colossal embarrassment. Tillman meant a lot to recruiting efforts.



I don't think the government had anything to do with it. His dying words were "Don't shoot! I'm Pat Tillman Goddamnit". I think his team was tired of him and someone got fed up and killed him. its happened before in the Army. They probably thought that he was going to get them killed- and acted to defend themselves.

please dont take this like i am justifying soldiers killing soldiers, I'm just sayin it happens



And that boys and girls demonstrates clearly the limits of the value of inductive reasoning. Merely because an explanation fits the facts doesn't mean that it is accurate. The explanation must actually be demonstrated by the facts.

reprobate

reprobate

New Orleans, LA
December 2002

AUG 02, 2007 09:25 PM

KUNGFOO said:

emotedcreations said:
What do you mean where does it stand? It's bad? Carries heavier penalties? I'm confused.



Sorry. I meant, when does it become a crime?



Depends on the instant facts, because this is the military, and there are UCMJ charges that don't exist in the civilian world, for example dereliction of duty, which is a common charge that goes along with any serious charge committed while on duty.

At base, the question is whether the actor has a duty, either explicit or common sense. That is, for example I have no duty to make sure an individual gets their medication, or respond to an emergency, medical professionals do. Likewise, we all have an obligation not to do things that cause egregious and capricious risk of harm to others, like firing a gun into a crowd for kicks.

Generally in cases like this, if this was merely the result of a chain of small errors with a tragic result, administrative punishments or minor charges will result. In the even of gross misconduct, following illegal orders, recklessness or other extreme behavior will result in serious charges. It should also be noted that error could well be on the part of the alleged victim.

skeptik

skeptik

New Orleans, LA
February 2004

AUG 03, 2007 11:20 PM

reprobate said:

krncookies said:

JohnHaverchuck said:

FreakPirate said:


Again... what's the gain in covering that up?



It's a colossal embarrassment. Tillman meant a lot to recruiting efforts.



I don't think the government had anything to do with it. His dying words were "Don't shoot! I'm Pat Tillman Goddamnit". I think his team was tired of him and someone got fed up and killed him. its happened before in the Army. They probably thought that he was going to get them killed- and acted to defend themselves.

please dont take this like i am justifying soldiers killing soldiers, I'm just sayin it happens



And that boys and girls demonstrates clearly the limits of the value of inductive reasoning. Merely because an explanation fits the facts doesn't mean that it is accurate. The explanation must actually be demonstrated by the facts.



That, and since Tillman's brother was part of his team, the explanation would seem to indicate fratricide isn't just a military euphemisn any more.

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